Andy Mak

Wow episode 10, and today I'm joined in studio 1 by the big three ANZ, Comm...... NO it's Owen Butterworth, Scott Horscroft and Andy Mak. Andy is a resident producer at The Grove Studios has worked with a number of amazing Australian artists including Vera Blue, Kita Alexnder and Maanyung. tune in as we find out what makes Andy tick in another sensational episode of Welcome to studio 2.

Song Credits

No Cars Go 

Preformed by: Arcade Fire 

Written by: Arcade Fire 

 Produced by: Arcade Fire 

Source: Sony Music CG

welcome to Studio 2
https://www.instagram.com/welcometo_studio2?igsh=OXJyOGcxMTJveHhj&utm_source=qr

Andy Mak https://www.instagram.com/andymakmusic?igsh=MXBrNXFvZXd2MXc4bg==

Scott Horscroft https://www.instagram.com/scotthorscroft?igsh=cTVja2I0eXV4cmd4

Owen Butterworth
https://www.instagram.com/owenbutterworth?igsh=MTdvdm12ZXNydXlqbQ==

The Grove Studios    https://www.instagram.com/thegrovestudios?igsh=MWwzOTViMnEwN3d3bQ== 

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:02

Hey Owen, what do you call it when you take mushrooms at a at a line dancing festival?

SPEAKER_03 0:09

Uh a fun fung I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 0:13

It's a doasty dose. Jesus. Um so let's get let's get going. I feel like I should be getting welcomed to the studio today because I'm sitting here with three of the big guns of the Grove Studios. Um I've always as always we've got Owen across from me. Um Owen the Magic Man, I'll call him. Uh today we are going to have a chat with the ethereal, may I say Andy Mac?

SPEAKER_02 0:38

Wow, I don't know if I've been uh referenced in that way before, but thank you.

SPEAKER_01 0:41

Well, we're gonna start with it. I think that if you ever turn into a world champion boxer, I think that should be your name, Andy the m the ethereal Mac. I'll take it. And today joining us on like episode 10 is Scott Horscoff. Good afternoon. Scott's hiding in the corner. He said he just wants to pipe in with some wise remarks and um select jokes as needed. But uh, so we'll we'll we'll see, we'll see what happens today.

SPEAKER_00 1:08

Poised and waiting for the right moment.

SPEAKER_01 1:10

We'll forget he's here 15 minutes in and so yet again, although we are running with the name Studio 2, we're lucky enough to be sitting in this beautiful control room in Studio One, which um kind of gives me a chubby every time I walk in here. Um but so thank thank you. Thanks for having us here. You're welcome. I think um so Andy, uh you are one of the producers up here and also uh songwriter. I've had the pleasure of listening to your song reel over the last few days to kind of get a gist of you know what you've been doing up here, and I suppose that's where I I came up with that word ethereal, because I think a lot of the songs on that show reel could, you know, kind of give that whimsical sound to rock and roll, if I may say. Um so how did you get into music? Um, what was were were you brought up in a musical family? Is it something that you've you've chased yourself or were you beaten to do it? Uh a bit of both.

SPEAKER_02 2:14

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um so I mean my mum was musical, she she plays the piano. Um, and so yeah, I'm I'm one of four kids, and we all started the piano at like you about kindy, five year olds. Um and so I started learning s the Suzuki method, which is like one of the classical styles of piano. Um, and there was a lot of whipping, you know, because no one wants to I didn't want to practice, I just wanted to to play. Um but uh yeah, started with piano and and kind of kept that up till I was about 18, really, just learning and going through the the method and doing doing all the all the piano-y things and concerts and the Steadfords and whatnot. Um so it all kind of started there. I think piano I'd say is my main instrument, but that was kind of the foundation I guess for falling in love with music.

SPEAKER_01 3:08

Yeah, cool. And so obviously piano being your main instrument, um when did you do you're obviously multi-instrumentalist these days. When did you start adding like more instruments into your repertoire?

SPEAKER_02 3:21

Um probably I would have been in a maybe like 11 or 12, maybe in like year six. My dad was like the pastor of a church, and uh we had like a band every Sunday, but uh one one Sunday the drummer couldn't turn up, so being like the pastor's kid, dad was like, You're playing drums this Sunday. And I was like, Okay, I bet I better learn how to play drums. So that week I'd just picked up the sticks and started playing and realised I could play, and next minute I'm playing terrible drums with this pretty average church band, but um being thrown in the deep end, I was like, Man, I love drums. So I just kept playing drums, and then same sort of thing with bass. I was like, Oh, bass is pretty sick. How hard can it be? There's any four strings. Um, so I taught myself bass, and a mate lent me a bass, and um, it just kind of all branched out, and and I think that learning the foundations on piano kind of meant that you know, A, you've got coordination, your different hands can do different things, you kind of get what what rhythm is and what notes are and how it all fits together. Um, so yeah, branching out into other instruments sort of I guess came naturally to me, and I and I didn't like sight reading, like I hated that sort of side of it. Um, so that probably meant my ears were working overtime to kind of try and compensate for all these other kids that could sight read on the piano. Yeah, um, so developing kind of those oral skills meant that I could kind of hear things and work them out and play them and fudge my way through.

SPEAKER_01 4:54

So that's interesting. Now you said you didn't like sight reading. Um, obviously, when you're doing those piano classes, you're you're kind of made to learn that. Did you do things? What I used to do when I was made to learn something was memorise it to death, like memorize it, you know. Oh, that sounds wrong, so play it again until I could get it right over and over and over and over and over again. Well, were you doing stuff like that and pretending you could pretty much read it? Oh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:17

I've I've faked it most of my life, to be honest. You just um do a little bit of uh work in the background and then pretend that you you know what you're talking about, which is kind of what I'm doing now. Yeah. Um but yeah, absolutely, but but I think that you know, if you if you were to go deeper into that, it's without realizing it, you're um you're you're relying on your strengths and you're kind of doubling down on what you are good at. You know, I wasn't good at something, so but I was good at at the listening and learning and practicing, so I just kind of doubled down on that to compensate, yeah. Which now is like a skill that I like I don't need to sight read very much these days, but having those skills to hear something and play it pretty quickly is I'm so grateful for that. So yeah, you could call it cheating or just going with your strengths without realizing it.

SPEAKER_01 6:09

No, I found that with my little um, you know, I started trying to get into learning music theory, I suppose like you know, nothing crazy, but the minute I started learning little bits of music theory, I found it made playing a lot easier. Not not that music theory teaches you how to play an instrument, but I think it explains how certain sounds are made. So when you can start to understand that and put those patterns together on your instrument, it becomes a bit more second nature rather than you know looking for it or having to read it or being told what to do. Yeah, it feels right.

SPEAKER_02 6:39

Absolutely, and it takes the mystery out of music, you know. For the average non-p musical person, they're just hearing this thing that they like and it makes them feel good. But that little bit of theory or understanding, you go, Oh, this isn't that complicated, you know, even whether it's Bach or Mozart or a Taylor Swift song. You can once you've done a bit of theory, you realise, oh okay, it's kind of these same four chords over here over and over, and then they do this in the chorus, then this in that bit. There is a formula and and maths behind it all. So I think having a bit of understanding of how a song works by doing that theory just it simplifies it, makes it less daunting, and you kind of can wrap your head around it a bit easier.

SPEAKER_01 7:20

It's a bit of a mix of um the theory and the feel, really, isn't it? To make it hit. Absolutely. Yeah, cool. Very quiet, Alan. Just listening, just taking it all in. He's just writing a note.

SPEAKER_04 7:30

Learn theory. Learn theory, yeah. Do you think that your I feel like because I've seen you play lots and I've seen you um learn songs and I mean you when was the last time you had to sight read like that? Would have been like fucking what? Ages ago, right?

SPEAKER_02 7:49

Well, it it's it's stylistic, right? So I'm working on a on a musical at the moment, and um long story short, w went to went over to LA to record all the vocals for this thing, and the the director gave me this folder which had the entire score in it. And most of these songs have seven singers on each song, all do it like a musical, right? They're all doing different melodies, and then they come together for harmonies, and um and he was pretty keen. We're both keen to respect the the writing and the score and to get it right. So suddenly I'm there for ten days in this studio with you know, sitting in front of a console with just with sheet music everywhere. And so I mean that that was earlier this year, so that was like a moment where I'm like, man, I'm glad I I can actually read a score. Yeah, um every good boy deserves fruit.

SPEAKER_01 8:40

Seriously, how often do you actually reference that? That's how I have to do it to be honest with you, every single note, but um, you know, that's that's fine. Um so you started bringing in other instruments into your repertoire kind of you know around 11. Obviously, you said you were kind of performing and doing all that panel stuff up until 18. When did um you know producing or or even songwriting start coming into the mix for you?

SPEAKER_02 9:11

Yeah, it's a good question. Um so probably early high school I I started to transition into like just sitting and playing at the piano. I was still learning the Suzuki books, um but I found myself way more interested in working at chords and just composing, I guess. I had no idea what I was doing, but it was like I liked the sound of this this chord and then this chord, and then I maybe get four chords and just play them for hours, and then it that was I guess the start of oh you can make your own music, and that that was a game changer for me because that then led to um you know writing a piece on the piano and then I got cue bass in this is about 2000 and oh, this would be 1997, 98. Um got cue bass, and then I realized oh man, you can you can orchestrate on this, you can pull up a violin sample or a drum sample and you can create with technology. I'd I'd I'd before that I had like little keyboards with I'd program beats and bass sounds and and play along to that. You could do rock bossa nova or bossa nova 2 the rumba, yeah, yeah. Yeah, which was you know that would that was cool. Um so discovering cue bass and a computer, um that was the game changer. So then I I'd take my piano composition that I wrote, you know, chords, and and I'd just start arranging that and turning that into a a a piece of music, and it kind of that was then a big part of high school for me was doing that sort of thing. Yeah, cool. Did you go to a um performing art school or no? I went to um it was like a sort of a a pretty chill private Christian school um in Sydney, and uh thankfully they had a like a music head of music that was awesome. Like he uh you know if there's one person in my uh life apart from Scott Um that's uh had such an impact on me, um it would be this guy. Um then probably your wife. Yeah, I'm Scott music teacher, yeah. She won't listen to this podcast, so you know not that. Now that the air's clean, I can start talking. Um yeah, it yeah, it it had an inf a big emphasis on on music, which was cool. So he he really sewed into me and and introduced me to composition, which I didn't even know was a thing, and um then I did composition for my HSC and um like he'd stay late helping me notate like because you have to hand in a score, and I was terrible at sight reading, so he'd stay late and be on one computer notating with me, and I'm doing the other computer. And the kind of guy that loved music, he did a composition degree himself, and um he invested the time and and sort of brought that love and turned it into something tangible, you know. Um, so tons of opportunity playing bands and um a couple of these compositions that I wrote, like the school orchestra would perform them and I'd play piano with them or the jazz band, or so just having that opportunity I think really helped to hear your music live, which a lot of people, unless you're in a in a band or whatever, you don't really get um so a few of those little moments were probably a game changer as well.

SPEAKER_04 12:47

It especially in I guess uh non-contemporary music formats, it's cool that you got to hear your compositions back from like a school band because I know uh the young people that do composition or any that I've interacted with, the only time that they hear it back when they're doing their HSC pieces is like over Survelius or whatever like scoring thing they're using, you know, it sounds like midi bloody whatever. So it's sick that you got that like immediate or you know, semi-immediate feedback from your composition at like tender age.

SPEAKER_02 13:17

I'll never forget the um I I wrote this composition, I only ever heard it on the computer, as you said, and then uh I I came to an orchestra rehearsal, and it was this the full orchestra, and then part of the band that was the jazz band that was there as well as big maybe there was like 70 people there and a grand piano, and my musician was like he was conducting, he's like, Okay, you're ready, let's take it from the top. And I was super nervous, and it was a piano intro, and so I started playing, and then the orchestra came in, and it was horrible, and I was like, Something's gone. And the conductor stopped, he's like, Are you playing in the right key? I was playing in the completely wrong key. That's how nervous I was. Let's start again, and then I played in the right key, and it was it was amazing, but yeah, I'll never forget that first time I heard my piece played back and how bad it sounded.

SPEAKER_00 14:08

When was when was the first time that you played in a large band, you know, in a in a big band or an orchestral band? What what was that first experience and how did that feel?

SPEAKER_02 14:21

The very first experience was um in year six and we had a concert band, and um it was like a little just my local state school in Western Sydney, and they didn't even have a drum kit. They had like an old sort of side side drum and a snare drum, but they realized that I could play the drums. This was about the same time that I was playing drums, and one morning the principal came into my classroom and he said, Can you can you come with me? And I was like, Oh, here we go. That's a normal Tuesday for me. But um took me into the hall with the deputy, and on the stage was this brand new Percussion Plus drum kit, shiny and black. Now, Percussion Plus is the the cheapest drum kit you could possibly buy, but that was that was the greatest moment, and they were like, Go on, go on play. So I got up there and just bashed bashed the drums out, and that afternoon was concert band, and that was the first time I was on the full the full drum kit with the concert band, and that was it was awesome because it's like singing in a choir or playing in a band, doesn't matter as soon as you're playing with other musicians, it's it's the the best feeling ever. Um so weird, that was a a long time ago, and I'll just never forget that feeling of playing drums with the band and and it would have sounded so bad. Oh yeah, I'd been playing drums for three weeks and it was like one clarinet and a tuber, you know what I mean? But it it didn't doesn't matter, it was the best feeling ever.

SPEAKER_00 15:45

Similar to a couple of points like sight reading music, um, and playing in an orchestral band. I um, you know, with my flannelette shirt and long hair and probably a ACDC t-shirt became the drummer for the the theatrical band at my school, and the first um first year that I played it was Bye Bye Birdie, which I'm not sure if you music know the music, it's you know, 3-4, quite jazz inspired. You know, I'd been used to playing Let There Be Rock um and um had had the music in front of me, could not read drum music for the life of me, so would go home at night and play to the CD and and come in, have the music there, flip the page at the right time, but just all the whole musical from memory, um and probably terribly um but uh got through it. But yeah, again, that experience of you know clarinets coming in but and a saxophone and a full band hitting it at the right, it's just an amazing experience to know that as a drummer that you can completely stuff the whole thing up quite quite quickly because they're listening to you for time.

SPEAKER_02 17:00

Yeah, you literally you're holding the whole thing together. So it's uh that that began the uh pursuit of power, I think, in our in our lives, right? Like just being in control and failure, and absolute failure. It doesn't take much to stuff everything up.

SPEAKER_01 17:17

No, that was bit I was actually heading there with that question anyway. I suppose I was um kind of saying we a lot of the music that we got to hear that either people were um coming up with themselves or you know, just just as we were learning, young teenagers learn it was all rock and roll. So I suppose having that opportunity to do you know composing these probably a bit more complicated pieces and uh uh you know three power chords and some swear words it's probably really good to good experience to have at such a young age. So I suppose that that drove you to can uh continue doing I suppose what you do now, which is still make beautiful music, right?

SPEAKER_02 17:58

Yeah, hopefully it is a bit better.

SPEAKER_01 18:02

Um have you as a composer, have you got a piece that you're always working on that will never be finished that the Machnamopus?

SPEAKER_02 18:12

Yeah Yeah, it's called My Life.

SPEAKER_01 18:14

Um whether he's gonna tell us he does or not.

SPEAKER_02 18:20

Yeah, no, I'm just trying to think of which one to share. Okay. Is that the rock opera or is it the space rock opera? Yeah, I've started I've started quite a few various projects over the years and probably self-sabotaged them to death. I think um yeah, you you are always composing and you're always creating, and there's moments of inspiration where you like dig deep into a a project, but I think um being a perfectionist um and it being I guess the side hustle, it always ends up taking a backseat. Um but thankfully also like creativity is a full-time job, so that it's not like I'm a I'm a a school teacher and and cre creating the time outside of that to to get my creative fix, you know. I get to do it as a job, so that itch is always scratched um every day. Uh but yeah, yeah, I think I think I think most producers and composers would have things that that they'd be doing or finishing if they had the time. Um but I don't know, never say never. Never say never I pursued DJing at one point. What was your DJ name? Well, we never really got that far. Um, but it was me and me and my bro, and a friend asked us to DJ their wedding. Because like you guys are music producers, you can DJ, right?

SPEAKER_05 19:57

Like, sure. Yeah, how are they?

SPEAKER_02 19:59

Just playing songs. That's my dream for someone to say that to me. Yeah, it's coming. It's coming. I wanna you can DJ my next wedding. Perfect. Um told you my wife's not listening to it. Um uh yeah, so that was that was yeah, you guys can DJ. So we we got some decks and then realized just how hard DJing is. I think we spent maybe three days consecutively non-stop actually working out how to how to DJ. But then being classic, you know, producers and perfectionists, we were like, let's nail this. So we're getting we were creating loops and triggers and and getting samples and every transition had to be had to be right on and blending and mixing live these songs together, and we got way too carried away. But the I mean the wedding went off. Hell yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:50

Did you wear like special DJ outfits or we were in full tuxes.

SPEAKER_02 20:54

Full tuxes, nice. Yep, um, which was good, and I mean the worst part was we forgot the power cord to the decks. And this was a wedding in barrel on a Sunday. Yeah, um, so we we ended up uh sending people to everywhere we could possibly think of friends' houses, all that couldn't find the cable. So we ended up high the hiring decks from an audio company that night, and they brought the decks in for us. And they brought a power cable. Well, we wanted a power cable, we had to hire the whole the whole unit.

SPEAKER_01 21:25

Just you like thank you.

SPEAKER_02 21:26

Yeah, it was a really expensive lesson in not forgetting a power cable. But the set went off. So that was, you know, I guess the fulfillment of one side hustle that I've seen through to fruition.

SPEAKER_04 21:36

You know, uh on like uh club night posters or DJ posters where it's got like James and Scott back to back and it's got B to B, your DJ name with Tom could be Mac to Mac.

SPEAKER_02 21:49

I like that. Yeah. I'll um you can pattern that. You can still I guess that's your twenty percent taken care of.

SPEAKER_01 21:58

So how did your How did your relationship with the Grove start?

SPEAKER_02 22:03

Oh, another another thing I'll never forget. I was I had a studio in Sydney that we that we built. I had a few studios and this was like the the this was meant to be the last one um after building quite a few starting from like my parents' lounge room to like a mate's granny flat kind of progressing and this was like a big warehouse that we built a full recording studio in. Um and I was probably two years into that and it was humming, everything was good. And then I came up here, there was a there was a resident sort of producer here named Andy Sorensen. His wife was the studio manager and he was based in Studio Two, that was his studio, and he was mixing a song for us. Um and I sat with him and um I remember sitting having a coffee on the balcony of of the house down outside of studio two and having this moment of revelation I guess in that you can make music like this. I was going to a warehouse every day, like there was the the auto the auto mechanic, you know, then there's the import-export guy, drug dealer, yeah, um, next door. It's always good to have a drug dealer in the store though. Oh yeah, yeah. No one buys that many kids' toys from from that warehouse. It was a front. Um, and I just sort of soaked in what this place was and it re and it ri the history of it. Um, I think at that same day Silverchair was in this studio, so their cars were parked up the top, and you're just sort of immersed in that wow, this is this is the real deal. This is as as good as it gets, it's a beautiful place to be. Um and in that moment, I was like, I've got to be here, I just have to be here. So that I went home and told my wife, I'm like, I think we should move to the central coast. And she was super down for it, and she was like, We did just build a studio. Um, but yeah, uh that was about 12 months later we moved here and um have been on the coast and and working out of the grove ever since. So it just kind of said to Scott, I'm I'm working here from now on.

SPEAKER_00 24:11

Yeah, it was pretty he Andy was here before me. Okay, yeah, so I met Andy part of the furniture. I met Andy at the auction.

SPEAKER_02 24:18

Oh, cool.

SPEAKER_00 24:19

I think that was the first time we met.

SPEAKER_02 24:21

You had come, I don't expect you to remember this, you know, you were such a big deal. Um here we go to safe space. You you you uh you had come through in a walkthrough once, and I was in the barn at that point, and you came in and we met and you gave me your business card. Huge, it was a big the front of it was an EMI logo, and so instantly I I put your number into my phone and and I took a photo of the EMI card, and up until about a year ago, that was your picture that came up every time you called me, was your EMI business card. Huge. I then changed it to a photo of you um wearing a hairnet at a a go-kart center that you sent me. Oh, that's it. But that's now your your photo. Um makes me laugh every time you call. Um so we met very briefly on your walkthrough and then the auction and the rest is history.

SPEAKER_01 25:11

Cool. And now Scott's one of your collaborators. Yeah. When you say that, I heard you say that before, and I actually read it on your um on your the Grove profile, your producer profile. Um, what do you when you say collaborators, does that mean kind of anything you work on you're showing Scott, or you just collaborate on stuff every now and then? Like what do you mean by that? I mean it's super fluid, right? Like it it like sex in 2025.

SPEAKER_02 25:38

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You do you, man. Um edit. I'll leave that in.

SPEAKER_00 25:46

I will not be associated with anything.

SPEAKER_02 25:49

No. And that was the end of our collaboration and our careers all together. Um it was great up until now. Um to collaborate, well, yeah, it it I mean it it it started out of a friendship, I think. You know, we we we became really good friends, and then we we worked on uh on a record together. I can't remember the first one, but it was let's let's dive in, and you've you probably had a project and you're like, come play some keys on it. And very rarely do you meet very rarely do up to two producers work together, you know. Normally you hire a producer and and they make the record, but Scott and I from that moment just had a I guess a synergy in that we don't step on each other's toes, we approach music differently. Uh I feel like we listen to each other really well, and um it's just this beautiful space when we're in the studio together, and it just rolls like we've been doing it forever. So um, yeah, collaboration is just the the two of us in the room making music together, and we'll naturally wear different hats and fill in the gaps, and um there's no real rhyme or reason to it.

SPEAKER_00 27:05

I think the first big record we made together, like in terms of a full album with full production, um, was I was approached by the incredible uh artist Steve Clisby, who um was uh who's an incredible African American man. He must be eighty plus eighty. He just turned eighty, yeah. Well this this week I think. Um and that was probably about eight years ago. So you know we're talking about a man in his 70s who um wanted to do a a record of covers, but really modern covers. So like things that were in the charts at that time or things songs that had been hits within the last couple of years, um, and he wanted it to be f futuristic um in it in in its instrumentation and and how it sounded. So um you know, I think for for me uh I would traditionally go and find a a large-scale band to bring that all together, but it felt like a lot of it was going to be programming and beats and and you know, in the box production, and having heard a lot of Andy's recent work at that time, um, you know, that's uh something that where Andy and I are very different, like he's an incredible player of instruments and musician and and you know can can really um um play all instruments to build a production, whereas I'm traditionally work with with bands and um uh and and don't play. So the two but I'm you know highly critical of everyone else in the space. No you do it, I don't need to. I can't. Um so you bringing Andy in on that album, that was my first um uh experience of seeing how amazing he is at um playing and developing a track. Um and from there uh we've worked on and yeah, lot lots of records together, lots of singles, lots of writing sessions. Um you know, we've got a a great habit of finding young artists that we we really like and um bringing them up to the studio and just doing some exploration and experimentation together. Um I think that's where we really work well together is is in those kind of development um scenarios. But we've also made some great country albums and yeah, it's it really really varies. But um yeah, uh for for me that collaborative part comes from as Andy says, we're sort of very different in in our skill set and uh maybe plug some plug some uh missing pieces.

SPEAKER_01 30:05

Um I remember when we're in here with uh Tori and we'll listen to a couple of things and you actually said to Tori, I can't wait till Andy gets his hands on this. So um when you get given some music like something like that from Scott, um obviously that the collaboration part comes into the fact that he trusts you to do the right thing to that song and for that artist. How do you go about that process? Because it has to be different every time, like respecting somebody else's art and you know adding to it without overpowering it. Like how how do you how do you deal with that?

SPEAKER_02 30:46

Well, having worked with Scott for so long now, when I sit down to play on a track, I I already know what he's gonna say. So um so I kind of jump straight to that version, which takes out all the self-indulgence, all the making it about me, yeah, and just gets me to sit in the track really nicely. So that that um that helps. But uh I mean you you you're there to serve the song, you know. I always think that when an artist trusts us with a song, it's it's really special, you know. This song has come out of out of their heart and their experience, and they have labored over the creation of it, uh, and it means it really means something to them. Um, so I I firstly I try just not not to mess it up and try to treat it with the respect that it deserves. And I think approach being there as a servant rather than the star, yeah, is a mindset that I think a lot of really good producers have. And so when I sit down to play on it, it's it's you know, what would Scott tell me not to do? And then how can I best serve the song on this instrument? Um and often it's it just flows out of that because the every song is different, right? And every artist, and and so that that there's the point of difference. And then I come in to to add and to I guess respect and and and and bring a bring a layer to the song, um, it's actually quite easy. You know, if you can get out of your own way as a musician and and just serve what's going on and what people have built, it it just seems to flow pretty pretty easily.

SPEAKER_01 32:30

I suppose the artist lays out the framework with the chords or the the energy they give him with the song for you to add your little touch, I suppose, right?

SPEAKER_02 32:38

Absolutely, and and and you know, it it it already sounds amazing, you know, that that Tory record, you know, it it coming in at that point of of the record, and I I was privileged enough to be in the pre-production for that, where the we we were fleshing out the songs and throwing ideas around and hearing it at that point and then coming back in to the process when Scott had had recorded this beautiful album, you know, every tone, every sound, it it's it's world class, and then to sit at the grand piano that's beautifully mic'd up with headphones and and play. It's I mean it it's easy, you know, and and it's it's such a nice part because Scott's such a good producer in the sense that he will produce the track knowing that I'm gonna come and play certain things, so there's there's already a real space left for me. Yeah, yeah. It's not a wall of sound, it's not just because we want piano, it's like well I can hear where the piano goes. So he's putting together this whole album knowing I'll be playing piano and organs and some synths, and so the gaps are there, I've just got to go and sit sit in them and and kind of do my job.

SPEAKER_01 33:47

Yeah, that's crazy. Well, that's my learning thing for today because that blows my mind thinking that you're you know, obviously that much is going on during the making of the song that you're still leaving room for other things to happen even when you don't have it. So yeah, that's it's an art.

SPEAKER_02 34:03

Yeah, most most producers overproduce, you know, and and fill it up. And you know, I'm guilty of that. You get towards the end of a song and start muting things and and then you hear the song come to life because you know 30% really doesn't need to be there. So to be able to produce that just from your ears and experience is um I think pretty unique. I think a lot of producers are missing are missing that, or it takes them longer to get there.

SPEAKER_04 34:31

Yeah. Had um had a great moment watching the two of you work recently. I also work with a production partner, Tom, and all four of us were on a session, and we started like drums and bass, and Tom and I are in here for a couple of hours, and you guys were out on the deck, and then you you both came in, you were like, right, time to do some synths, and Tom and I went to the back of the room and watched the both of you go whoop woop woop whop woop woop all of these awesome synts down on the track, and we were both just like jaw on the floor, but it was also like looking into our future, like that'll be us one day. That was sick. A little more time.

SPEAKER_02 35:12

We've got all this to look forward to, Alan.

SPEAKER_01 35:16

All of this um so let's head back to your song reel because we did bring that up before. Um Vera Blue, if you haven't been congratulated for any of that stuff, congratulations. Thanks, man. I mean, I you know, I've always kind of listened to Triple J so I heard her when she when she came out, but to be honest, I hadn't really listened to a lot of Vera Blue until I put on and I I think I think that's gonna make it into my into my favourites playlist along the way. Another artist that I that I was blown away by is it um Man Young, yeah, yeah, First Nations artist. Yep. How how do you approach something like that? Like obviously he's singing in language, but we're you know using such you know kind of modern music techniques, like that must be such a first of all, you know, something special to work on because I haven't heard a you know a lot of that, but how how do you approach the you know do you know what the songs are about? Like had you go through that all with him at the beginning. Does that help with the production process?

SPEAKER_02 36:30

Oh yeah, yeah, he's a he's a storyteller, you know, like through and through. He's a he's one of the most authentic storytellers I've ever met. So he will uh write the song in language. Yeagle is is the language, it's the kind of mid-north coast Yamba kind of region. So he'll write it in Yagel and then he'll tell me the story in English, and the way even you know, they say lost in translation, but the way that he tells the story, immediately I just picture it. You know, the first song we wrote together was um about the relationship between the wind and the sand. And you know, if you're walking along a beach and and the wind decides to visit and blows and it it meets the sand for a second and and they do this this this dance and then it then it blows off, and he he was sort of telling this story and it's it's like relationships, or it could be like a love or a lost love. And I I'm doing a terrible job at explaining it.

SPEAKER_01 37:37

Well, I got goosebumps, they do pretty good.

SPEAKER_02 37:39

Right, so you can imagine you know how how how it would feel for him to tell you that that story. So um yeah, that's that's everything. That is the catalyst for where the music goes. Then we'll have certain instruments that one represents the sand and one represents the wind, and it might be a synth and a guitar or a vocal. And over the song, they they start their journeys, they meet together in this psychedelic instrumental moment, then they go about about their way. And that's just one example, but but yeah, his his beautiful storytelling is the is all I need to to be able to write a song because he just paints the most beautiful picture.

SPEAKER_01 38:20

It's like I when you listen to it, it's like you don't even really need to know the lyrics, you can feel the song, which is you know, I I'm not saying I pictured that, you know, that dancing or anything like that, but you just you feel the emotion and you feel that it's definitely it definitely means something to him. Um that's for sure.

SPEAKER_02 38:38

Well it's authenticity, right?

SPEAKER_01 38:40

And it's I think it's a you know beautiful way of uh telling ancient stories in a modern way, which is really what needs to happen to you know keep the message travelling, I suppose.

SPEAKER_02 38:50

Well that and and that was you know that that was a big part of the project. You know, he he wasn't interested in fame or success or you know, he's a beautiful guy and and had a had a day job working with sort of underprivileged youths on the coast and um and and sharing his his culture with them and um just being an absolute legend. Um so it was always about him telling his stories but blending that with modern music. So the music was deliberately very mainstream, very triple J, if you will, just very you could put an English singing vocal on it and it would sound like m the music that a lot of people are listening to. Um but deliberately that juxtaposition of of him singing in language against something that we're so familiar with. Yeah, I think that's what drew people into it because immediately you feel it at home listening to it musically.

SPEAKER_06 39:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 39:54

Uh and even though you don't understand the lyrics, it just doesn't seem to matter. Like you say, a lot of the the heart and the soul on the story seems to come through, and I think that's because it's authentic. Like we weren't we weren't trying to do anything, yeah. We were just making beautiful music and and telling his story. And I think when it's authentic and real, that's when that's that's when it works. That's when people feel like translates. Yep, yeah, yep.

SPEAKER_01 40:19

Cool. Um another band on hopefully is it Woodlock? Yeah, that was like um the song that you have on there on your songreel. I got a real like Sufyan Stevens vibe from that.

SPEAKER_02 40:32

Was that intentional or um probably in the songwriting stage, yeah? Yeah, yeah, I'd say, I'd say that's an influence. Um, yeah, I mean they're they're one of the more underrated Australian bands, I'd say, that they write such good music and they're so talented. Um and they've had some some success, but but not nearly as much as I I think they deserve. They're so good, and they they channel, I mean they give me like OG coldplay vibes, but then mixed with this Sulfyan or this folky, you know, kind of worldly element as well. Um super talented guys. Again, that's another one where you just try and serve serve what they're doing and how good they are and and and help bring it to life.

SPEAKER_01 41:20

And in the collaboration process, this just popped into my head. Sorry for going back a little bit, but um Scott, do you ever have somebody kind of approach you and they're like, Oh, I want to make this record, and you're kind of talking to them, you hear it, you go, that's an Andy record, or like is that is that something that you guys do like somebody has their heart set on working with you, but you're like, you know, not that I don't want to work with you, but this guy would be better.

SPEAKER_00 41:45

Uh yeah, but definitely um had yeah, I mean there's projects at the moment that you know we we started together. Um I guess, you know, I felt that there was a place for me in the initi initiation of the record, like picking songs, looking at structure, looking at an overall vision, getting a process together, um, but then realizing that you know the the getting into the nitty-gritty um and the way that Andy was working with the artist, that you know that there really wasn't a a role for me left after that sort of initial it's more of a takeover, is it Andy Morgan? A really subtle one. Um really long game. Yeah, but that I mean then the project comes back to me at the end to to mix. Um so in a way it's still this sort of huge collaboration and the vision is set, and we're I guess more that we both sort of understood where it needed to go. Um and you know, Andy's uh one of my favourite things to to witness and watch Andy doing is is recording vocals. Um and um, you know, whether it be getting the the right performance out of them, um the patience and direction that he he shows um in getting the right vocals and the support he gives the artist through the process. Um you know, a lot of the work in this project is around around that. Um so um and and other projects as well, but you know, Ben Swisser was another another one that we were both involved in, but again a majority of the work was with vocal production. So um yeah, there's specific specific specific b artists and parts of the process that I think um um yeah. I mean it's such a big job that often if you trust someone having the ability to step away and someone else To come in and you trust that the job that they're gonna do um is is uh as good as you could do, or if not better, then it's just a great way to to be able to get space from a project and come back in and find new perspective um as a creative. I mean, you know, but it's it's it's a huge amount of um focus and uh um engagement um and time but to to make a full album. Um you know, a lot of the time it ends up sort of being five days on on one song.

SPEAKER_01 44:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:39

Um and some and depending on how you're making it, splitting that up. So to have someone in there to to go back and forth with and step back and think about the overall vision, new ideas, how things are rolling, um, are you missing anything while while another part of the record is is being um being made, it's it's super cool.

SPEAKER_01 45:01

Do you really need two flutes in that song, Scott? Always minimum.

SPEAKER_00 45:07

One jazz, one I'm hardly prepared.

SPEAKER_02 45:12

Well, that's the beauty of of a good collaboration, though. It's as often in the unspoken, you know. We Scott and I just know if we're sitting here, you'll you'll watch it over the if you time lapsed at you know 12 hours, it's just various points of us both being in control, but there's never a conversation of I'll I'll take this bit or I'll take this bit. We just as the song's evolving, we just both have these roles that just naturally dance around the studio doing different things. Um and that could be over a week. Scott could be in and really hands-on, and then I kind of take over for a week, and then Scott's back in and fresh perspective, and I think that's one of our real strengths is that all of that's unspoken. There's there's we've always got a plan, a big plan of how it's gonna work, but in the detail, it's just we we know each we know what each other does and brings and trust each other, and it's it's a really easy, a really easy process.

SPEAKER_01 46:12

Cool, cool, cool. Have you what's coming up for Andy Mac? What's a holiday? Any any of your opuses will be available to rent to ISO?

SPEAKER_02 46:23

So$29.95 at HMV. Remember those days when like people paid for music? Um, anyway, it's a whole other podcast.

SPEAKER_01 46:30

Um we talk about it nearly every time.

SPEAKER_02 46:32

What have you what's your what's your take? I remember printing like 500 CDs, it was the minimum run. Yeah. And uh usually you'd be left with 450 sitting under your bed. But um it was a it was a beautiful time when an artist could take a box of CDs to their show and sell them for 30 bucks and make money.

SPEAKER_01 46:57

Yeah, I used to give people my EP instead of change. I kept the change, here's an EP.

SPEAKER_02 47:04

I love that. Thanks for buying a t-shirt, here's an EP. Um look, we're it we're we're at a we're at a really weird point in history right now, but I I guess my thought is that art Art has just survived everything that the world has ever thrown at it. It doesn't matter what what it is, art is always art's always being made, and it always survives, and it looks different in every season. Um and I feel like you we can be super worried and and and and you know there's a ton of concerns, and it's really, really hard right now for a lot of for a lot of artists and um but I think the hope doesn't die because artists will continue to make art because they have to. It's it's what they do. Um and so however we end up getting through this crazy time, we will still be left with great artists making great art, and hopefully there's a way to continue to monetize that so that they can be better supported and keep doing what they do, but nothing will kill art, it'll just keep getting made.

SPEAKER_01 48:20

Some of the best art and music is made by people who come from the hardest circumstances, so if the economy keeps going how it is, we should have some really good music popping up soon.

SPEAKER_02 48:28

100%, man, and that becomes the you know, a songwriter is writing a song for people that can't write songs, right? Like they they go through an experience and they release it and then it becomes other people's song because they've put to words and music what someone else is feeling, but they're not a songwriter, so they can't express it. So it's it's a gift, right? Um, and out of hardship, some of the best songs have ever been written.

SPEAKER_01 48:56

Yeah, uh so yeah, art will survive and it will continue to grow and hopefully there's a there's a good way to speed up the process and and support support artists, but yeah. Yeah, I suppose that's a big thing as well. We just gotta people have to go back to supporting artists. Like if there's an artist that you like and you listen to them on Spotify and you get to hear their music for free, hit their shop up and buy a shirt or a hat or a stubby holder or a ticket for a show or a splurge and buy their vinyl, you know. Like help them out where you can. It's and obviously you can't, you know. We're lucky that I can listen to millions of artists without having to go out and buy H C D for 30 bucks because there's no way in the world I'll I would be listening to all these great artists. So I suppose um understanding that your art is getting to people who would not otherwise hear it, maybe some kind of um you know uh uh redeeming factor of streaming music, but yeah, you know, it it's it's still nice to get out there and support local music too, not just the big guys.

SPEAKER_02 50:03

Oh 100%, man. And and and you know, I got a buddy who's a f uh indie filmmaker, and he's like you artists that are whinging, he's like we can't just make films and put them up in the same way that you can make music and put it up. You know, so much goes into a film, even a short film, like that is that is such an investment of time and people and the process, whereas musicians can make a great song, put it up, do the hard work and get people to listen to it. So it is in that regard a the best time in music for people to be getting heard. Um so it's a great attitude. Yeah, um, yeah, I'm all for it. What are we gonna sit around complaining, or are we gonna put our big boy pants on and and figure out a way to f to fix the money side for sure? And I think that's great, like support Australian artists, you know, that that is go go to shows. I love in that I was in Nashville and um you know, down at just one of the one of the bars and there's there's a live band playing and everyone's dancing, it's a great night, and and then they pass the bucket around, and people are putting in 20 bucks, 50 bucks. It looked like 20 bucks minimum, and and their culture is whatever you'd sort of pay for a ticket to see this band, you just watch them, so that's what you put in the bucket. Yeah, so these guys I I chucked 50 bucks in, I'm like, yeah, these guys were a phenomenal country band. I'd easily spend 50 bucks to watch this. Yeah, so that was the culture over here. It's like someone's busking in its pocket change, but over there, that real appreciation of I'm watching good life. Yeah, tip culture, but placing a monetary value on what we've just received for free, yeah, uh, and voluntarily putting real money into their bucket, um, it it's that idea of showing you appreciation, which is kind of what you're saying, of I really appreciate this artist and I'm going to pay them what I think what I think they're worth, what I think that night was worth. Um so adopting that kind of principle where we really genuinely support the local bands and artists that we love and and um supporting them financially, but also getting people to their shows and streaming their music and following them and commenting and like building them however we can. I think the more we adopt that kind of value mindset um will only help move the needle in a positive way.

SPEAKER_01 52:26

Alright, bands. Next time you're down at the budgie pub playing on a Saturday night, I want you to put a bucket out the front. Let's see what we can get going. Yep, yep,$20 minimum. Bucket at the budgie.

SPEAKER_02 52:37

I like it.

SPEAKER_01 52:38

I like it. Let's start this. Uh no, no, that's look, that's that's absolutely awesome. Um cool. Andy, what what keeps you ticking outside of music? Do you have any hobbies that are unmusic related or um why I don't know why the long pause.

SPEAKER_02 52:59

Um I'll just try to think of when was the last day off. Um yeah, I mean I'm a I'm a dad, I've got three beautiful kids. Um so any time outside of the studio is usually um with my family, and that um, you know, they're aged they're between sort of 10 and 13, so right in the thick of I I call it the fun season because they're not in nappies and they can all swim. Uh, and but they're young enough to like still be really engaged and fun. And uh so it's the sweet time of of being a dad. It's it's my kids are the same age. Are they? Yeah, right. So you get it, right? Well, I really the the best time was when you could all be at the beach in the surf and you're not worried about anyone drowning. Yeah, you're like, this is I've made it. Except for you. Um so that that that's the sweet spot. So yeah, family, I mean family's everything.

SPEAKER_01 53:53

Um kids sport runs on the weekend or sport, coaching cricket teams.

SPEAKER_02 53:57

Oh, cricket, we're at cricket, are we? Yep, yep. We're we're we're at cricket. Um right, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 54:05

We might see around the traps.

SPEAKER_02 54:06

Yeah, the under under 15s this year.

SPEAKER_01 54:09

Oh no, we're we're a bit younger, we're in the under-elevens. Okay, you're still there, yeah. Well, no, under thirteens. Under thirteen. Yeah, sorry.

SPEAKER_02 54:15

Yeah. Um that sort of thing. I mean, we live we live where we live, which is like beach culture. Yeah. Um, so we love the beach. Um, I f I find just even a walk, even just driving to the beach for five minutes is a is a mindset, you know. Have it, is it? Good mental health, good, good, good positive vibes, you know.

SPEAKER_01 54:35

One of the best things about um when I when I moved up to the beach, like living in Western Sydney and going to the beach with kids, and you know, you're like, oh, everyone's good, let's go to the beach, and drive out to the beach, and then you get there, the kids are like, I fucking hate sand and I don't want to be. And you're like, Alright, and you pack up and you go home like that was good, and you know, four-hour drive or three hour drive for five minutes of the beach. But when you live five minutes from the beach, you can go home and come back down an hour later. It's so fucking good.

SPEAKER_02 55:03

Oh, yeah. And it's free, right? And it's free, yeah. It's free entertainment, man. Like, yeah, my weekends as a teenager was like catching the bus to like Parramatta Westfields and wandering around.

SPEAKER_01 55:13

We grew up in the same area, too. Yeah, yeah, Western Sydney, that's what we had. North Paramount North Parramackas. Mate, I went to I went to school and I'd play footy for Parramatta Junior Hills. We used to, I'd tell you a great story about North Parramatta. So at Parramatta Stadium, they got Parramatta pools right out the front, right? And our school used to go to Parramatta Pools for sport on a Wednesday, and we used to go and hang out there after school and on the weekends and that, and they had they got the diving boards there, so they had the um one and a half and three metre diving springboards that you could jump off, and then they had the five metre, seven and a half metre, and ten metre platform as well, but they were locked off so you couldn't get up there. But the fence was like two foot high, all right?

SPEAKER_02 55:53

And there's no it was a suggestion. It was a suggestion, please keep off.

SPEAKER_01 55:57

It wasn't a rule. So we kind of figured out that if you got caught jumping off the ten metre board, they'd just kick you out. So that was our way of leaving. We would just jump over, they'd kick out, we're like, we're going home anyway. Um, and then we started figuring out that if you could pretty easily climb over the fence near the toilet block, so after Parramatta Eels games on a Friday night, we'd all go and jump over and just swim in Parramatta pools for like half an hour until somebody chased us out. It was the best jumping off the 10 metre board at night. Uh yeah, after an Eels game. After an Eels game, after watching the Eels getting flogged, which is always good. Oh, night supporters.

SPEAKER_00 56:33

Some things never change.

SPEAKER_01 56:34

Everything's never changed, yeah. It's not the 80s anyone watched in the night. Yeah, you then do follow the Eels.

SPEAKER_02 56:41

Yeah, Neel Support, right? Yeah, every every every uh time they played Friday night footy. Yeah, and that was back in the uh the where the the hill days where the half stadium had two hills. Yeah, so yep, on the hill I played footy for school, so we had like season passes to the Eels um game. So yep. What position did you play in footy? I I so I had a growth spurt in year six. So in year six my only growth spurt, um so in year seven I was one of the tallest, believe it or not. Huge. Um so I would start, I started, you know, as a prop, and then year eight, sort of a bit more into the center by by year nine I was a winger. Yeah, you know, as everyone else grew and I just kind of stopped growing.

SPEAKER_01 57:22

And that's a tough whole story politically challenged. I moved into the halves because I had nobody else and I couldn't run fast, so I was taken off the wing.

SPEAKER_02 57:34

Yeah, then we're cutting oranges by year ten, but it was a it was a good time. The boys gotta eat. Go on. Yeah, that was that was uh that was growing up in in in in the west, but yeah, man, like having the beach, it's free, kids love it. I'm like, why would you why would you do anything else? Yeah. And it's my son's 13 now and he's just realised that he can go and meet buddies at the beach and jump off the rocks and and wander, you know, just yeah, it's it's positive, they're not getting up to too much mischief because there's so much to do.

SPEAKER_01 58:08

We had a um you know, the old community Facebook group, and the kids were a few of the kids from the Surf Life Saving Club were were out one day and doing a bit of knock and run. But these days everyone has a ring doorbell, right? And it's fine, and it tells them before you even get to the door. Yeah, so the kid they got busted a couple of times, they just ran away laughing, as you know, as you do when you're kids. But somebody was like, Oh, these kids playing knock and run, rah-rah, and then you know, one of the other local guys was like, You're probably the type of asshole that we complain about and sitting inside doing nothing anyway.

SPEAKER_04 58:47

I mean, anyone that uses those Facebook community groups are the kind of assholes that just complain about every year.

SPEAKER_01 58:52

Yeah, uh, but no, I say let them go, let them have a bit of fun, run around. Yeah, but they call it ding dong ditch now. Oh, yeah, they watch too much American shit. Too much TikTok. I've told my kids no nah, it's knock and run. It's knock and run, baby.

SPEAKER_02 59:02

Yeah, yeah. Because you you knock and run. You knock and what do they call?

SPEAKER_04 59:07

Ding dong ditch. Good for alliteration, not good generally. It's poetic. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 59:12

When they're more creative now, but yeah, it's it's that American influence coming in. Back in my day, kids weren't creative. No that's a problem with your generation. Oh, we loved we love to whinge on Facebook, not we, but that that that generation. Yeah, oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 59:30

Have um any questions, Owen?

SPEAKER_04 59:34

No, I mean I have like one kind of nerdy question that's been on my mind for a little bit. Um you said when you're a kid you did the Suzuki method, so I'm guessing you went from like Swift to Gymney to Vitarra and shit car joke. I'm a cherry I'm a Cherokee now. Yeah, yeah. I know that your son is a musical genius. Did you put him through the same uh Suzuki method, or is there because there's like the letter one as well, right? I can't remember what it's called. A M B. Yeah, yeah. And what's the difference between the two is my question as well.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:13

It's a great question for um two of your listeners that'll find this interesting. Um I'm kidding, I'm kidding, it is. Your wife isn't gonna listen. One. Um Yeah, so the Suzuki method i in the short form is that Dr. Suzuki, this awesome Japanese guy, um was watching babies learn to talk. And he's like, babies learn to talk simply by copying their parents. He's like, so why can't they learn music just by copying? So he developed the Suzuki method, which um doesn't involve in the early phases, doesn't involve any sight reading. You can be one. As soon as you can sit at a piano, it's you can hear a sound and learn how to copy it, like a kid learns to to talk. Um, so it got kids interested in music a lot earlier. Um, as you go on, as you progress, you then learn sight reading and whatnot. But you've got these two and three-year-olds that are playing Mozart and Beethoven, these really simple bark pieces, um, all from listening. Yeah, uh, so it's a fantastic method. A, you'll you're you're developing those skills early, and B, you're playing the repertoire is genuine, amazing composers like your Beethovens in the in the simple form. Um, and then you see great. I mean, Alicia Keys studied Suzuki, Ryan Tedder, the producer, studied Suzuki. You see all these successful artists and you dig a little bit deeper and you're like, oh, that is Suzuki piano. And I think what it does for your um oral skills, kind of what we talked about earlier, is it develops and engages them really early. So then you're 10 years old and you hear a song on the radio and you go, Oh, I can figure that out. And so naturally you're just hearing and playing and hearing and playing. So I think it's heaps more enjoyable than cracking the whip and having to learn sight reading from the moment you sit at a piano. Uh yeah, my son's my kids are all learning Suzuki. It most instruments now are part of the Suzuki method. Yeah, right. Um so yeah, I just think it it was a I was really grateful because I didn't like sight reading, but um I think it does wonders for for a kid's development.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:18

Yeah, so are you I didn't realise all of your kids played instruments, so are you keeping the Mac family band a running? Absolutely getting us sick.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:25

Yeah, yeah. I um none of them have to be producers, yeah, but they all have to play.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:30

They all have to play.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:31

I see I see piano, I just say you're learning piano until you're 18. Yeah, right. And then you can do what you want. I just see it as part of their education.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:37

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:38

Uh and they're all they all semi, they enjoy it as much as a kid learn likes learning piano. You know, they're not all that stoked to practice. Um, my son is, um, but he's he's like that. Yeah. Um, but when they master a piece and they can play it, like they're stoked. Yeah, so I see that as important as swimming lessons or going to school, it's like part of their education. There's tons of research that that showed how how important music is in the development of a of a child and their journey. But um, I just have met so many adults that say, Oh, I learned piano, had a teacher, hated them, so I quit. I wish I never quit. Yeah, and that's just the story for so many people. So I'm like, Well, you're not gonna quit till you're 18, you'll be able to play, then you can quit. Yeah, but you won't regret quitting music and you'll be able to play for life.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:25

Because then when you're 30 or 40, when you go, I wish I could, you go, actually I can. I can. That's right. Yeah, yeah. Even if you're a bit rusty, you still can. Yep. Oh, I've got another question, and this one probably goes out to all three of you is um, what's your favourite part of being at the studio, whether it's a a a piece of equipment or a room or a vibe, like what's your favourite thing about Studio One in particular?

SPEAKER_04 1:03:54

I can start. I have one immediately that I thought of. I love um normally kind of at the start of a session, so when a session starts, you'll come in in the morning, you'll be setting up microphones, then the band will arrive, you'll set the band up with gear, um, and if it's like a full band, then you're kind of setting everyone up. You start with the drums, then you go to the bass, then guitar, guitar, vocal is kind of how I work through it. If everyone's playing together in the room and say you set it up, or if it's just the drummer, you just obviously do the drums. But I love that very first time, once you've got all the mics up and you've got all everyone's in the room and everyone's arrived, and they've you know, like that first time you hear all the band play together, and you go, it's like normally like maybe like 12 30, 1 o'clock if you're kind of chugging away in good time, um, and you hear everyone playing at you and you're like, fuck, alright, this is where we started, like we're running. That's always my favourite kind of part, especially especially when I'm up here, like because it's normally like I get here at 8 o'clock and it's like go, go, go, go, go, go, go, and then the band starts playing and it's like now the day's started. Like that's kind of a fun bit that I really like, definitely. Yep. I gave you guys time to think and everything. Yeah. Scott's like, what's the question?

SPEAKER_00 1:05:13

What's for dinner? Um favorite thing about the studio?

SPEAKER_01 1:05:20

Well, yeah, just you know, like what's you know. I mean, mine's driving in the gate. When I drive in the gate, I'm like, yeah, sick, I'm here. Yeah. Mine's because you fixed the gate. Yeah, the gate doesn't work without channels. Um, let me ask you this then. After you bought the place, right? You've bought the place, you've moved in. Did you just walk in here one night and just kind of look around going, fuck, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:49

There's a beautiful story about uh uh for me internally, I don't know even know if I've I've ever told this, but I I grew up in the southwest suburbs of Sydney. in Picking Point on the Georges River. And in our backyard, you know, was a it was a bushland. And um so you know, I grew up sort of wandering through that bush with my German shepherd from a really young age. Um this was, you know, being ferocious German shepherd that my parents were fine with me just going all day with and you know it wasn't amazing. So I feel like a lot of my spirituality and my sort of inner understanding of the world came from wandering through the bush with a dog. Um and when I bought this place there was a moment where um we sort of moved in and it was a very busy time for staff, helpers, family, everyone was here but as the the sort of afternoon wore on I wandered off with my dog and went down and sat on a a rock which um you know it's really sacred and special place down the back of the road. Lots of First Nations carvings and artwork and just places where you can tell people have existed for a long, long time. Yeah. And so I sat on this rock and and the dog at the time Archie blue cattle dog sat down next to me and at that moment this big flock of black cockatoos came over the top of me and were just going wild like flying around and having fun with each other and I just got this huge sense of something special had happened and it wasn't you know just me, it was you know I think the dog seemed pretty happy, um the birds seemed happy the family and everyone were back up in the house. I could hear you know music and laughter and you know that so I g I guess that sense of um community. I mean even the fact that we're all here now having a yarn you know it's it's you know we we had a manager up here today all of us having a meeting and talking about that community. He's just moved here f from America um and is you know learning the industry and learning his place in the industry and you can see his sort of um sense or feeling of his initial reactions to the place and what we do and you know that sense of community here to help out, here to collaborate, here to experiment um that runs true and I think you know for me that's that's the most important thing about the place on you've had a lot of time and and and the desk and the desk yeah yeah the gear.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:53

I mean yeah what he said except the black cockatoo leave with the dog in the rock is my favourite word they're awesome and their their projection. Man vocalist could project like a cockatoo.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:11

Like you can just walk and go what's happening here and look up here.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:17

I think um music making can be a a pretty lonely solo experience particularly these days where more and more people are making music from home. Uh so to to arrive at this place and see all the all the faces uh and to be around other people making music. I'll be in one studio and I know Scott's in another studio and Owen's in another studio and it reminds you that there is you know a community and other people doing what we do and chatting around the coffee machine and playing on each other's tracks um that I that I think is fairly rare these days. Even even in places like Nashville there's a lot of great studios but there's usually one studio. You know the idea that there's five different studios on this beautiful property and all these all these people making music um that's rare and that that's a real to pick me up you know that's really that's energy and enthusiasm that and the piano. That piano is one of the best sounding pianos I've ever played and uh yeah that'd be my favourite piece of gear.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:33

Cool um soon as I said space. One thing you love and hate about each other now that's easy where do I say the hardest I closed the gate Scott by the way thanks for no worries just talk about things you hate about each other don't leave the gate open I for a while especially every time I worked up here I always kind of parked in the in the driveway um for those that don't know the studio isn't just a studio this is Scott's homes here as well so um you know down there at Studio 2 the home's right next next door to studio two when I work on when I've always worked here I've always just driven up and parked in the middle and um I reckon every time I've been here doing work poor Annie's had to ask me to get me to move my car and I'm like I reckon she absolutely hates me with the car in the driveway and Scott's like oh no you picked that wrong she couldn't care less but yeah I just had this vibe that every time I you know if it was my driveway and somebody was and it was the same car every time I'd be like get this guy out of my driveway. It's not Annie that has the problem it's Scott He's just too nice to say Annie go and tell him to we hide behind our strong women nice nice well guys I think we've had a great chat today um thanks for joining us today Scott as always thank you to the Grove Studios and also the Academy for you know helping me with the podcast I always appreciate that. Thank you Andy Mack for coming in and the way we roll out is with a song recommendation from your good self so sorry to if you've been put on the spot with that one but I gave him a heads up cool yeah yeah and you think that that meant I prepared I learned not so much I can put in like the countdown while you're trying to we can edit it out.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:31

Yeah um yeah narrowing it down to one song is it does uh is there any does it have to be like an i an an iconic song that or a song that changed my life or not not at all just a song you feel like you listen to on the way home. Oh right um okay one that you probably haven't heard there's a band called Arcade Fire I've heard of Arcade Fire and there's a song called No Cars Go. No Cars Go and it's it is one of the songs that gave me more inspiration I think than than any other song. I mean there's a there's a few of those but this is this is one of them and it was recorded I think in like a big old church and it has it has what sounds like the full arcade fire band but then like a horn section and string section and an organ and it just grows and grows and becomes this monster by the end and takes you on this epic journey but in like the coolest indie rock kind of arcade fire way. So I think it goes for maybe like six minutes but chuck that on in the car on the way home you you'll love it. I will thank you thank you.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:42

Thanks Dave of the Lick of the Jin and Click of the L and the star of the journey Between click of the lie and the star of the dream the twin and click of the lie and the star of the tree