Benny Pounder

Old friend and top bloke Benny Pounder joins us in Studio 2 for this episode. From gigs at the local youth centre to working in some of the biggest studios in the world, Benny shares stories from his musical journeys. From his first recording telling a band he could record them when he didn't know what her was doing to, building more studios than you've had hot breakfasts, working at Abbey Rd Studios (the second-best studio in the world), to having his own secret home studio that I've been lucky enough to visit. I hope you enjoy my catch with Benny, Special shoutout to Nathan "the harp throb" Harvey for making a cameo   

Song Credits

I fought the law  

Preformed by: Dead Kennedys 

Written by: Sonny Curtis

 Produced by: 

Source: GoldState Music

welcome to Studio 2
https://www.instagram.com/welcometo_studio2?igsh=OXJyOGcxMTJveHhj&utm_source=qr

Benny Pounder https://www.facebook.com/share/1ByLz12JRh/?mibextid=wwXIfr

Nathan Harvey https://www.instagram.com/mrharveymusic?igsh=Y2RneW1ucnNucWVv

Owen Butterworth
https://www.instagram.com/owenbutterworth?igsh=MTdvdm12ZXNydXlqbQ==

The Grove Studios    https://www.instagram.com/thegrovestudios?igsh=MWwzOTViMnEwN3d3bQ== 

Transcript

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Jimmy 0:00

Well, hello. And today, as always, I've got the magic man Owen Butterworth. And across me, I have like an old friend, and not old, well, yeah, old, but an old friend. I've got grey hair. This guy I've known since I was maybe about 12 or 13 years old, I reckon. Yeah, wow. Yeah, so it's been a long time. And um today we're talking to Benny Pounder. Benny Pounder, how are you going?

Benny 0:30

If I was any better, I'd wet my pants, mate.

Jimmy 0:33

Uh awesome, I'm gonna use that one. I like to say any better, I'd burst, but I'd yeah, let's go with that. So today we're gonna talk to Benny about a bunch of stuff. Um, you know, his early formative years of music, and then we'll lead into kind of what he's doing these days, and maybe even uh let Owen and Ben nerd out on what he's got in his home studios because Yeah, not for too long though. Not for too long? No, but we're gonna have it. Get that note already on. We might need it today. Um so Benny, I met you in high school, and I've actually told this story. Well, I've told a little bit of a story about you on the podcast already. When the old Wentworthfield cow shed days were around. So that's when that's when I first met you. You used to come down to Northmead High School and put on Battle of the Bands and barbecue days and stuff like that. Like um, I mean, you were only a teenager yourself back then, like 17, 16, 17, something like that. Yeah, yeah. Um, old enough to have his peas because I remember that little van gigmobile. That was awesome, mate. That was awesome. So the cow shed, explain to the people that are listening what the cows shed is and you know how you kind of got yourself organized or involved with that, yeah. And with the youth of Western Sydney, I suppose. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Benny 1:52

Yeah, yeah. Well, I was a blow-in at the cow shed, um, played my first gig there. It was pretty important to Western Sydney as um uh around those areas uh councils were all about politics and not about youth or entertainment or anything like that. So what happened was is uh if I was say a young 14-year-old kid that was playing guitar and had a friend that was a drummer, and obviously at that time we're talking about the grunge era, so every kid was playing guitar, every kid was playing drums, every kid either knew or could play an instrument, it was just the popular thing to do. Um so there was lots of kids with that that were basically playing music, but there was never any venues around for people under the age of 18 to play, let alone people over the age of 18 back then too, because it was the rise of the poker machines, so venues were closing, like um, but anyway, in that era, um there was a guy called Keg who started it. I can't tell you the full-blown background story, but he was a youth worker that identified that his outreach would be better suited to have live music and having that youth centre in Wentworthville based around live music.

Owen 3:04

So was Keg on his birth certificate? Yeah, pretty much, man. He's a top low. James, I can give you his number.

Benny 3:10

You should get him and Kieran Duke Burns in here to talk about the back history. So before I was there, it was sort of like a pre-genre of guy bands like Cryogenic, um Spilt Milk, um, all those sorts of guys, which were huge in Western Sydney. Um and everyone was wearing their shirts, everyone knew who they were. I'm sure you knew the bands. I think Owen might even have heard reminiscence of them. Yeah, no, they that they were Western Sydney cult music, you know what I mean? Um so what happened was is uh this this venue was already having those bands. What happened was is all these guys were turning 18, 19, 20, and moving on to obviously places like the Iron Duke, the Annandale Hotel, doing the doing the rounds on the pub circuit, because obviously they're at age. Um so what happened was it was a whole younger generation of or void that was missing. Um Keg went out. Um I was playing at a school band thing or something, and it was like a concert night, and um and uh he happened to be going and basically approached us and said, Hey, do you want to play this? Um so I played, and obviously first real gig um and not playing to like five people that were friends, but playing to like a hundred people in in a crowd, and they were cheering you on, and none of us no one they didn't know our originals, but they were sure trying to sing them after the second chorus, you know. It's like fuck this is really cool, you know. I mean, I was sort of I think that was at that point, I was like, fuck man, this is what I want to do, you know what I mean? Um, so that's what I did, and um was playing that and I did a few gigs there. Um, this is way before your time. Yeah, and then basically after about a year or two of just sort of hanging out there every time the show was on and uh playing there, obviously, in between bands, I got to know a few of the bands as well, and a lot of my friends' bands started playing, and uh it soon developed that um I was in a group of ringleaders for all these bands that were playing. So what happened was was uh these guys got me and three other friends involved. Goomboy was one of them, um I don't think it was Bromman Chalker, um, and they got us involved in being a younger generation of what they call the band committee. Um that was my first experience with sound. So what they thought was I was Bromwin did all the organization with the bands and same with Goomboy, um, but they put me more on the production role, and I had no idea what I was looking at. But my first band I jumped on uh basically was mixing spilt milk for the first time. And that's the first time I ever touched a mixer, you know what I mean? And I mate, I was sold on it. It was just like how much control I could have over making the vocals louder, the drums quieter. Yeah, I was sold on it, you know what I mean? And that's pretty much where my original passion or first wow, this is so you know, egg dropping my or the penny dropping moment, you know. Um but anyway, cut a long story short, moving forward about a year, um, we were talking, and what we what I did what we what we discovered at an early age is um venues and bands do not attract a following unless it's a cult following. And I think that's what a lot of bands miss. And and back in um in the um in the 90s, is I think that venue got it right. Because what happened was is people came and they stayed, and they didn't come to see any Pacific band. They just went, they just went to the point where people were living like if you talk to any kid that grew up in that area that went to the cow shed, they were living through the month to go to that venue, literally, okay, and it was the last Friday of every month, and if you talk to anyone in that area, they'd tell you, man, cow shed that night. That was what they did. It didn't matter what else was on, yeah, that's where they were on a Friday night. And uh and it was like a cult, and it soon became probably I think the biggest night there. Well, I mean you've got to remember that the the the the the actual hall was not much bigger than this room, yeah.

Owen 7:06

Right.

Benny 7:07

Yeah, it was a tiny place, but I remember one night there was probably eight to nine hundred kids breaking out to the breaking out to the park because there wasn't there was a basketball the drain the drain was full. The drain was full, like you could not move. Um and they had the PA, they had the doors open, and people were watching these bands from literally the drain.

Owen 7:31

Wow.

Benny 7:31

Um, and and people were moshing in the drain, like it was crazy. Um, and yeah, and basically it just grew and grew and grew to a point where um counts they they're actually asking council for support, like we need a bigger venue, like we can't house this many kids, and not only do we need a bigger venue, we need funding for security, we need more youth workers to police because we like what do we do with this many kids? Like, you know what I mean? And um council at the time, um, I think it was uh was uh it was sort of a it fell in a funny position because it was like Cumberland Council and Paramedic Council. I can't I can't remember the details of it, but they just would not fund anything to do with youth-related activities. Um very um uh probably 50s Christian sort of people that ran it, so they were very conservative, young kids should be seen, not heard, you know what I mean? And and and that's exactly what it was like. So they couldn't get any funding, people wouldn't help it out. Um, they had a leagues club next door, um, and what basically happened was is there was that many kids, um, it was deterring from people attending the Leagues Club because they were driving into the car park and going, Well, this is a bit scary, and driving back out. I mean, you see what you know they've 300 you know teenage metal heads, and back then it was it's like you know, if if you if you're someone if you're if you're if you if if yeah if you're someone going like you know an older person wanting to have a slap on the pokies and seeing that in the car park, you'd kind of be a little bit cautious. And obviously then the complaints were risen, police came, and after a period of time of complaints, it was closed down, which was a real shame. That's true. But the legacy did continue. Yep. Um, so you had things like Wastelands kick off. Um a lot of those bands put venues on and still do, so there is a community still in that, but it's not as like that, you know what I mean? But um, but but a lot of people learnt that um yeah, cult following is what it's about. And um, you know, you see Lincoln Pin's kind of doing it at the moment, yeah. You know, that Lincoln Pin's got a bit of a cult thing going on. Oh, they sure but Central Coast, it's it's it, and that's kind of if you can think of the Lincoln Pin, but everyone's underage and yeah, it's got like masses, but but if you watch Lincoln Pin now, that's almost like it was, it's very reminiscent of what the vibe was. Like if you you could we could go to that venue this Friday night and not know a band, but I can guarantee you would all have a friend in common there. Oh 100%. You know what I mean? And that's what this place was like, you know. Um but it was bigger, you know what I mean? And it was it was just yeah, a bit more community, probably a bit more evolved. But yeah, um, but you can see places like that is the is that there's a there's the cult thing happening, you know what I mean? And that's that's what um that's what that place was. And when you went there, you were part of didn't matter who you were, you were like, well, James will tell you.

Jimmy 10:13

It was the most welcoming place I've ever been to. Like I was man, I was just you know, a young kid, year seven, year eight, when I when I first started going down the cow shed. And you know, there were there were adults like the you know, there was 20-year-olds and stuff down there, like people that seem a little bit scary, even even though and when you walk in and the music's playing and the vibe was just so great, and you were you're welcomed in with like with open up, like it's such a great memory of mine. Like Benny was right when he said you used to live through the month to get to the cow shed on a Friday night. Like it was the highlight you you wouldn't go to other parties, like everyone at school would be going to a party and we'd be going to the cows shed because that's that's what we did. Like, yeah, yeah, too bad, so sad. Like, either come or miss out. Like, yeah, but to give you a kind of idea of of where it is, so it was it was perched on the side of the the Cumberland Highway in Wentworthville, and just to the side of the Cumberland Highway, there's this, it's like the stormwater drain, but but it's like you know, two metres deep, it's kind of got those curved walls like you see in like the skate games and stuff like that, where you can oh like yeah, the fucking stormwater. And then there was like a little dribble of like algae water going down through the middle, right? And so we just all you go see your band, like Benny would come and pick everybody up in his little van, and I think it was just so he had more people to watch him play, to be honest with you, but but he'd go around and pick everybody up. No, and he'd but he'd do two or three trips. So Benny'd be driving around for the first couple of hours, you'd you get there early, and we'd been sitting there and you know, like uh statue limitations gone on this one. You know, we'll we you know had a few VB throwdowns or something down in the drain, sit down there and have a beer and chat with all your friends, and your your mate's band comes on, you run in, you watch them, and just the community and the friendships that kind of grew from that. Like, I mean, a lot of people I don't speak to still, but if you bumped into them, you'd you'd still best mates, like, which is you know, that's the kind of community the cowshead was, which was awesome. So, um, and I think one other thing I'd like to say, Benny, I think you're the first person to make me realise that there's music outside of what you hear on the radio, you know, like growing up, oh yeah, man. Growing up, all you hear is what your parents listen to or what's on the radio, and I think like you know, I credit my my love of listening to bands that aren't massive or you know aren't getting played on commercial radio, like that it comes down to a lot of your influence, so thanks for that. Oh geez, man, I'm glad of um yeah so I remember another another thing about those early years is uh we used to get in your van, and I remember you were the first person that I knew to have like have their own recording stuff even back then, and I think it might have been might have been um the Who My Generation, yeah, and you were like playing along to it over the top and singing and shit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I remember you like put it on in the car, you're like, listen, how does this sound? You know, like, yeah, fuck yeah, like rocking out on the way. Like, yeah, yeah. So I mean you're obviously still doing that now, but when did your um you know your passion for recording or production like how old do you reckon you were when that because you were 17 then, so you must have been pretty young when you're I started recording at 15.

Benny 13:24

Yeah, sick, and that was for myself. Yeah, so I I had back then there was no one to teach. I actually started it on a lie. Don't I I'll tell you the lie was basically I was doing sound at the cow shed and one of the bands just approached me and said, Can you record us? And I thought, yeah, I can record you. Amazing, no idea, yeah. I can do that, you know, and um so obviously there was no internet back then, like literally no fucking internet.

Jimmy 13:53

No Google how do you how do you record a band?

Benny 13:55

Nothing like that. So what I did was um was back then it was the it was the era of hock shops. So obviously living in Western Sydney, um, there was ample hock shops. So what I did was I went down to a I went to a music store and I thought the first place to go to is a music store and figure this out, you know what I mean? Um so I went to a music store and there was uh it was Murphy's music in Blacktown, and I think uh yeah, I I can't remember his, I think it was John there, and I said, I want to record, and he sort of laughed and said, Okay, what do you want? And I said, Okay, I want something to record with. And he goes, Well, you'll need a four-track.

Owen 14:32

Yep.

Benny 14:32

And back then that was how we recorded things at home.

Owen 14:36

It was a four-track, there was no Tazcam Porter Studio kind of.

Benny 14:39

Yeah, with Foztech, you know, there was it was just a little four-tracks, square machine this big, you know. Um, you know, um, for people listening about a four-line, you know, half foot wide, sounded terrible. Um, but yeah, that was how you did it. But um, and I said, Okay, how much is that? And then he dropped the penny and said it's $500. And I was okay, $500. And I thought, well, I'm recording in two weeks and I need $500.

Owen 15:04

Yeah.

Benny 15:04

So picked up my guitar, went down to Parramatta, bust my ass off for the first weekend, um, managed to rackle rack rattle up 300 bucks, um, and then literally um mowed lawns all that week, yeah, and I was 50 bucks short. Oh, and I went, okay, what am I gonna do here? So I had my dad was also a guitar player, and I had a Roland Space Echo tape machine. Nice, and I had a chorus ensemble original boss pedal. Do you still have that? Well, where do you think that $50 came for for the Fortress?

Owen 15:37

Oh dude.

Benny 15:39

Oh, and obviously back then, you know, the space echo was something that oh no, and I traded an 808 as well. I had sorry, 909, a 909 drum machine, and they were worth a 909 drum machine was pretty much crud back then. No one wanted them. Uh dance music wasn't really a thing. Yeah, um, it was sort of just like I mean, dance music back then was like, here's Johnny and what was going on at the raves. Like it was, it wasn't really as like you know, the central station record thing was really sort of only just starting to ramp up, you know. Um, so I yeah, I bought this uh I traded in those three items for 50 bucks and four tracks, and because I traded in those things, he was kind enough to give me a set of uh uh I think it was the Beringer first edition headphones. Nice, and he was kind enough to give me two SM57s and said you're on your own. Nice, yeah, fair enough. So at least he gave me mics and leads. And basically took it home and I thought that I was gonna make this thing so I thought I was gonna make this band sound like Fleetwood Mac, you know. For sure. And I got home and um in my head at the time I thought it was Fleetwood Mac until you listen to it, you know, 30 years later. But you know, I set it up and recorded them and gave them their tape, and um, I think they paid me fifty dollars, and I thought, okay, cool. And then that was the first one, and uh then the next one came the following weekend, which was friends of theirs, and said, Can you record us?

Owen 17:05

Yep.

Benny 17:05

And it went okay, and then I earned another fifty dollars. Great, and then the following weekend, another fifty dollars, and then someone said, Can we record Monday? So then it was a hundred dollars and managed to earn money at the time. And uh mind you, right then I was only like fifteen, sixteen. Yeah, wow. Um, so then I thought, well, I need the sound better, I need a better microphone. And then I th I sort of looked, did homework and found condenser microphones, and I think it was an Apex sort of U87 clone, sure. And um back then there weren't many clones under a thousand dollars, yeah, um, or in or many condenser mics under a thousand dollars. So I bought one of those. Um, I think it was like twelve hundred dollars. I mean, you wouldn't pay fifty dollars for it. Yeah, yeah. Actually, I don't think you'd even get a six-pack for one now, but um, but yeah, I I bought one of those and then just slowly grew. But my biggest um intake was when um I DADC Sony was being built, which is the big mastering studio in Huntingwood, and then there was a big CD manufacturing plant being built. And part of the I was uh I was an electric electrical I I I I I'd left school by then and I got my first year as an electrical apprentice. And I was working as an electrical apprentice, and um part of our job was actually starting to uh upgrade part of that Sony DAD or set up that Sony D A D C. And what happened was is a big truck, all these trucks came in with containers, and full of it was basically I think they must have emptied out the garage at Darlinghurst or wherever they were at the time. Gotcha. And there was all this stuff, and there was a big skip bin, and in the skip bin went a CD burner. And back then, CD burners, it wasn't like a CDR disc, it was a it was a proper. I think you've got yeah, you've got one here. You know what I mean? Like it was like one of those. And um I didn't back then you couldn't no one everyone wanted the CDs, but it was relatively expensive, you know what I mean. But I had something where I could go from four-track to CD, nice and I could give people CDs. Yeah, so what then happened was is all of a sudden it became five dollars for a CD.

Owen 19:02

Unreal.

Benny 19:03

And it kind of grew into that, you know. Um yeah, and then basically yeah, fast track along and it just grew and grew and grew and grew and grew. Awesome. Yeah, anyways, that was the early days. Sorry to waffle on. No, that's a good waffle.

Owen 19:18

Um it's I just the electrical so are you a qualified Sparky still?

Benny 19:23

And mechatronics engineer.

Owen 19:25

You know, you're like the you're like the the James and Owen hybrid, you're the super James and Owen combined, recording engineer, electrical engineer, all combined together. You're like what we could be if we had a baby together. You for me, yeah. Yeah.

Jimmy 19:41

So we've just got we've got a new guest in the studio, a friend joining. Uh jump on if you want. So say hi.

Nathan 19:49

Uh good day, good day, Scotty. First time and uh Scott.

Jimmy 19:53

Scotty, Scotty. Scotty is not present. Benny.

Nathan 19:56

Uh Benny, you have to.

Jimmy 19:57

And over here we've got uh the great Nathan Harvey. How you doing, mate?

Nathan 20:00

Nathan Harvey, good thanks, mate. Really good. Come to join us. Yeah, yeah. I was a bit late. I had a satisfying day at work, but um quickly jumped in the ocean and came came here and uh uh had a cider on the way and a couple of lollies, and here I am.

Jimmy 20:14

Very nice. Awesome. So um formative years, we've done that. So what let's um what are you doing at the moment? Well, yeah, I know you've got a you've got a nice little home studio. Uh we'll we'll keep the location secret for the moment. But um yeah, man, thank you.

Benny 20:33

Private, it's invite only, you know.

Jimmy 20:35

Yeah, for sure. So but um I mean you built that you built that thing with your bare hands. I watched the watched the process go down on social media, yeah.

Benny 20:43

You helped me, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jimmy 20:44

And um, I mean from slab up you guys did that or yeah, yeah, man.

Benny 20:49

Yeah, yeah, yeah. From ground up, man. Oh, it was a shed, it was a shed and everything. Well, yeah, sorry, well, yeah, it was a shed. It was actually a laundry, and I was recording um in there before it was a studio. So but just it was um I just needed to get rid of the fridge because it's not good having a fridge in the Hesh and Sacks on the wall. Yeah, but I got rid of it all.

Jimmy 21:07

Jim Morrison recorded vocals on the toilet, didn't he? But maybe I'm not sure. Yeah. LA Woman, I believe. It was the best, best sound. They they're in a house, they took the door off the toilet and sat on the toilet and recorded all the vocals on the dunny. Hell yeah. Yeah. On the throne. Yeah, on the throne. The man. So what was what's the process like building building a home studio like that?

Benny 21:28

I mean, um like I've done it 37 times before. Well, 37 times. Yeah, yeah, I've had lots of studios. Wow.

Jimmy 21:36

Um what you need to know is Ben Pounder is the epitome of well, like the mad scientist, right? He's got the you know the the the white the the Yeah, we're gonna call him Professor Tools.

Nathan 21:48

That's Professor Tools.

Jimmy 21:54

Uh yeah. So well, if you've done it 37 times, you must have it down by now. Right. Is this is this your final one, you reckon?

Benny 22:02

Um pretty uh never say never. Um you know what I mean. Um I I would like to think it is. Um, you know, I've I've built big commercial places as well. Like I had like my I I've had quite a few studios in between back when what I was talking about, and now obviously. Um but yeah, it's it's it's literally a studio built for people that I have worked with in the past that get a lot that we we gel, and also a place for younger musicians that can't basically uh can't afford to come to a place like this just yet. You know what I mean? But they're good, you know what I mean. And the thing is, is obviously a lot of the acts I'm recording now will probably end up being Owen's customers, or you know what I mean, here is because they they will move on, you know what I mean, and um and I'm happy for that, you know what I mean? Um but you know, walking in to a big studio blind, um that you can create a lot more magic in a place like this than you could say it somewhere like mine. But the thing is is if you learn the journey, if a young band comes in and gets it all down pat first and learns say my way, when they do come into a place like this, they come in prepared. A hundred percent, you know, and and they come in and instead of banging out you know, something that's average in a week, they'll bang out something that's phenomenal in a week, you know. And that's that's important, you know what I mean. So that's kind of where I like to sit. I pick and choose who I work with. Um it's a it's a it's a word of mouth basis. I don't advertise, I'm not a business. Um, I keep it very low-key. I keep off well, everyone that knows me knows I keep off the radar. Um and it's sort of if you know me, you know what I do. And if you don't know me, well, it's like I he owns that I think he owns a studio over where we're based, but no one's ever really sent it. You know what I mean? Like I I've I've actually said where it is now. No, but no, literally, that's what it, you know, you know what I mean. That's that's what it is. You know, it's a private place where you know there's it's it's leave your attitude at the door. For sure. Come in, let's just all bond, let's track, let's have some fun, yeah, and let's not look at the uh clock and count the hours we're paying for. Let's just focus on, you know, this is you're here, let's focus on on the music, you know.

Owen 24:18

That last bit, especially, is something that young bands in particular cannot wrap their brains around when they come up here. Especially for the first time, they get up here and they start tracking, and then someone will make a mistake in a take, and you can just you watch the wheels fall off from there. And it's like most of my job that day is trying to fucking keep the wheels on for the band. Um and it's you know, they start messing up takes, then they start wigging out about how much time they have to record, and you know, one of them's got a fucking mum's picking them up at fucking seven o'clock, so they gotta get it done by then, and fucking and then they just crumble. So those bands that do come in for that first time, and it's sometimes it's bands, it's I mean it's I to be honest, it's anyone who comes here for the first time, never having recording experience before. I find they just wig the fuck out. Yeah. Um which is I mean, the way that I kind of get around that is I do like pre-production in here first, and it's I kind of do that the same way. It's like, you know, just come in, we'll hang out, we'll have a coffee, we'll chat about your songs, not gonna charge her, we're gonna chill out. This is what the space looks like, this is what it feels like, and I found that that kind of helps. Or I do it at home as well. I've got a like a little home set up, um, which is super chill and same thing, just like this is what it feels like. Yeah, otherwise a place like this is fucking intimidating to a lot of people, which I you know, I do my very best not to. Like, I'm not a fucking douchebag while I'm recording these people. I hope I'm not. I try not to be. But you know, they see the big console, they see the fucking heaps of gear, and there's other people walking around, there's students, there's other bands up in studio one, or the inverse there in studio one, and there's other bands down here, um, and they just wig out.

Benny 26:06

So yeah, and that's it right there, isn't it? It's it's about making the artists feel comfortable like artists have got to feel like they can sit down on the chair and just feel at home, hey. Like that's that's pretty much where you start getting the takes.

Nathan 26:18

Hey, like yeah, can I ask you a question? Dude, like when you when you get a new band, do you actually send them something and say what you the good idea to send in pre-production and things like that?

Owen 26:28

100%, yeah. If I've never met a band before and I'm gonna work with them, I'll always like the first meeting is like coffee and or beer, or coffee and beer, and like listen to music, some of their music, some demos, some stuff that I'm working on, general references for what we're gonna be doing, um, and just make sure that we all know who each other are and that we're all gonna hang out and have a great time, talk them through what the day's gonna look like kind of timing-wise, so they can kind of you know know where they're gonna be at, let them know what I'm gonna be doing on the day, you know, like I'm gonna be here at eight o'clock, I'm gonna be setting up microphones, you're gonna arrive at ten o'clock, then you're gonna get yourself set up, and blah blah blah blah, and kind of go through all of that with them just so they know they know yeah, what's going on on the day. Helps them from helps them from going insane, I think.

Benny 27:13

Awesome. Yeah, absolutely, man.

Jimmy 27:14

So, Benny, obviously, um you've had a lot of experience in a lot of different studios, this one included. You've done a lot of work up with the code.

Benny 27:22

I've done projects here, yeah, before Scott owned it, but yeah, I've done it, I've done quite a few here. I've got funny there's lots of funny things I've I've done here, yeah. Yeah, yeah, cool.

Jimmy 27:29

And then um you were telling me earlier you spent a bit of time travelling as well, and you were working in studios overseas. Yes, yes, yes. Do you wanna do you wanna yeah, do you want to drop some names for us?

Benny 27:39

Abbey Road. Abbey Road, sick. South City? What what um London Bridge?

Jimmy 27:43

Yeah, what was Abbey Road like?

Benny 27:45

Yeah, nice, nice. Um, nice, intimidating.

Jimmy 27:49

Yeah.

Benny 27:49

Um I was way too inexperienced when I was over there. I walked in there thinking that I knew the shit, you know, and um within about a day of and I mean, like, how do I explain it? Guys like Chris Bolster are just gurus. Does that make sense? Like, it I don't think there's people in Australia on par with him, you know what I mean? Like, he is just a phenomenal engineer. Um, and you know, when a guy like that gets placed as your assistant, then you're going, okay. You know what I mean? You know what I mean? Like it's intimidating as hell, you know what I mean. But in a way, he is very humble and very patient, yeah, and um talked me through a lot there. And um did a did a few projects over there, you know what I mean? Um, did become part of the furniture at some point, but you know what I mean. But but it just it was you know, it was only for for for for for you know on and off for a year, you know what I mean? But but we were doing projects there, and it was just one of one of those things where I'd do a project and then I'd go away for in more project, another project here or there, but it was it was a it was a it was good. Um didn't have much to do with one or two, but it number three was where I did most of my stuff. Um but yeah, it was more mixing. Um obviously the artist, I mean you're talking 5,000 pounds a day there. Um, so you can't afford it like to track there, you need a big budget. So a lot of the stuff I was doing was mixing there. But I think um mixing there, especially with a like a like I don't I don't know. Uh have you had much experience with J consoles?

Owen 29:14

Uh SSL J's? Yeah, no, but the only experience I have with I've I've tracked on a K, obviously tracked on the G with E strips in it up here.

Benny 29:25

Yeah, but um Imagine a G with all its bugs that's old with the automation that sometimes works of a K. Does that make sense? Gotcha, yeah.

Owen 29:35

Yeah, I was just about to say my favorite part, my favorite um like SSL emulation is the J. So maybe I'll keep it that way. It'll just be my favorite.

Benny 29:46

But no, especially when you get the VCAs up and you accidentally hit the same number on two VCAs and then you watch everything just you gotta reboot, you know. It's like okay, don't ever do that. Um but no, um actually I have had every single one of those 96 channels um moving on that desk for a project. I think it was um that song was in the middle by Lucy Burke, and I did have every single one of those faders moving. I think the the mix took me three days to complete. It was a big big job. Yeah, doesn't sound like three days. I could probably do that job in about five hours now, you know what I mean? You know, to be old and old and dumb, you've got to be young and stupid, I guess. You know what I mean? Um, but yeah, no, it's um I think we finished off the rest of that project here, I think, um, in the um mixing it down in um studio one. Yeah, um, but there that would that was an interesting one that one. Um, but yeah, um yeah, other other studios was just uh I did I tracked in um I sort of tracked but also engineered in London Bridge over in Seattle um and I've done stuff in Sound City, but it was kind of like a rehearsal studio, it was kind of a weird in-between, like it was in that really limbo thing, and and back then I didn't really know the history or know anything of it, so I was sort of there for a day or two, but you know, but um yeah, but I used to own Billy Thorpe's old studio of which became which the brain later became. I gave it to Clayton over at the Brain. Yeah, and what do you call it? I I own that place. Um what do you call it?

Owen 31:15

Um did he have a Quad 8 console there?

Benny 31:18

No, he didn't have the Quad 8 back then. Um he had another he was in his own little studio next door, yeah. Um, and then I think he moved in what when I went, I I I went that's when I first went overseas. Yeah, and I was just uh back then, that's a whole story in itself with what happened with that studio. But um basically I had a lot of that was a lot of overheads, which I I was surviving and I was making a good business out of it, but I had a business partner die and um going through a divorce at the same time. So there's a lot of memories there, and I thought, you know what, Clayton, if you want it, pay the bond, it's yours, bro. You know, um obviously having two studios next door to each other with very poor sound installation was also a hassle. So there was there was times where Clayton and I used to lock heads because I was doing drums in one room and he wanted to do a Marshall Stack in the other room, you know, and um he was doing metal music, I was doing acoustic folk music. So, you know, those two studios next door to each other, even if it was a good studio, still don't match. You know, there's always bleeds. So um yeah, we used to clash all the time. Um, but yeah, that's when I sort of said one day I was I think I was doing drums with Matt McHugh, and um he was doing something that needed vocals done, and we were both crossbleed between the wall, and we kind of came to a head with whose project's more important. And I said, you know what, Clayton, do you want my place? And he went, Yeah. I said, pay the bond, it's yours, just let me finish this session. Yeah, he said no. And we and we did, and um, and that was how I gave that place away. But yeah, I've been in a few studios, other places like R R over in Blacktown, and um I got I do a lot of studio repairs as well and a lot of um funky stuff like for AC for studios and stuff. So I've done a bit for like guys like Rick O'Neill and Richard Burke over at Energy Free.

Owen 32:54

Did you help Rick move the fucking festival naive into his house?

Benny 32:57

No, no, I um I think I put my phone on silent.

Owen 33:05

Yeah, I've heard tales of that. Yes, yes, yes, yes.

Benny 33:09

You know he's got that in his lounge room now? Yeah, I've got you know it's like literally like it's it's mate, it is the best sound system.

Owen 33:17

Yeah, it's pretty nuts.

Benny 33:18

It's pretty fucking nice. Rick's a good mind of mine, man. I love Rick, he's a good, really good friend of mine. Yeah, um, yeah, but yeah, he's yeah, he um I do a lot of I still do a lot, he he builds studios, yeah. Um and I still do a lot of aircon or help him out with a lot of aircon stuff. Um but yeah, no, he's a great guy. Um yeah, and that that that festival needs a work of yeah, it'd be good for romantic interludes, you know, put a bit of sarday in your lound room, you know.

Nathan 33:41

No, dude, I'd marry that desk, you know what I mean?

Jimmy 33:44

Yeah, you'd marry the desk. Oh man, that's a bit of like a special bit.

Owen 33:49

What do you reckon, Alan? Like yeah, no, it's it's a nuts, it's an it's like it's like it's literally it's a piece of Australian music history. Like absolutely, and it also still would sound fucking incredible.

Jimmy 34:04

What has it recorded? Oh mate.

Owen 34:07

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It used to be in Festival, and Benny will be able to speak to this way more than I can because I wasn't fucking alive. I can get back on the phone if you want to. Yeah, it was in Festival Records in in Piemont, um, which was like the studio to fucking be an Australian musician and record. Um and yeah, it's it's a NEAVE console which is incredible and sounds amazing and is like hand engineered and wired, and yeah, it's it's an awesome bit of kit.

Benny 34:37

I'll give you an example of how big this desk is. Have you ever seen the Dave Grohl or Sound City, the Dave Grohl document on Sound City? This desk is its big brother.

Jimmy 34:47

Oh wow.

Benny 34:48

Yeah. But the one that Dave bought from Sound City is the smaller one.

Jimmy 34:53

Okay.

Benny 34:54

That's the only way I can. That's a safe assumption, isn't it? Yeah, yeah.

Owen 34:57

And that's in his lounge room. Yeah, I guess. That's what they tell me. I bet the rest of his stuff too, man. Yeah, he's got he's got some crazy shit. I I have not met him. I think we've emailed once and I follow him on Instagram, and his Instagram posts are just like the nerdiest, craziest shit ever, but they're the best raids. So good. It's like just a photo of like, you know, a vintage U47. He's got the guts of it all out. He's fucking testing like a tiny little bit of it, and he's like, I'm looking for this screw that I can't find, and blah blah blah. And it's just like it's he'll know where to get that screw, man.

Benny 35:29

Like literally, like if you need to know what size Allen key you need to undo an E1073 module, like he'll tell you what it is, he'll tell you the serial number of any like yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Nathan 35:41

Super nice guy though. Benny sent me once to get a big air conditioning plant out of his uh studio, and he had to shut down his studio though, because they put a gym next door and they started belting weights around, so that was a real nightmare for him. So he literally had to pull his whole studio apart because in his in his industrial sort of area, they put a bloody gym right next door, going bang, bang, bang.

Jimmy 36:00

So he needs to buy some property display. You should get Rick in on this show.

Benny 36:03

Yeah, we should we can recall. You should get Rick. Yeah, you should get him in on this because he is a big part of Australian music, yeah, history. You know what I mean? Yeah, that'd be awesome. Yeah, otherwise I'm talking about him, not to him.

Jimmy 36:16

That's very good. But I've got nothing.

Owen 36:19

We could see we could we should do um the podcast on tour and go to him, go to him.

Jimmy 36:27

I know where I'm if I didn't hit you. I'm in the so when I call I on the producer of the podcast, he always goes, Oh, that's very loose terminology. I bet you on that day he's the producer.

Owen 36:42

I rock up with my Ray Band and his audio technical.

Benny 36:47

I can just say he's got a new pet called Umon, you know.

Jimmy 36:52

Yeah, oh gosh.

Benny 36:54

So uh any big project you're working on at the moment you want to talk about or um man, I've got working on Nathan's epic night train journey that's up to 400 tracks, and we're trying to work out what to do with. Um I might talk to you later about mixing it here if you don't mind. Um it's kind of it's something that me and Nathan have been doing more as a social thing of like, okay, what does this sound like? What does this mic sound like? What does that mic sound like? So Nathan's been learning the recording process along the way.

Nathan 37:25

It's not quite track safe.

Benny 37:28

300, you know. Um, but it is it is a big it is a big, big, big, big song. Um, I've been working a lot with a be a local band called Toledo Lee and the Huskies. Um, I really love those guys. Um working with them, uh, another young guy called Cassidy. Cassidy Layla? Yeah, Cassidy. Yeah, yeah. So I just did his last one, only 21. Yeah. Um, and I've encouraged him to go over to Jack Negro for the another one. Yeah, and I think you guys are on the cards for his next one. So I'm encouraging.

Owen 37:54

We work with his mate Kalani pretty close to the case. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Benny 37:58

Yeah, and I hope he does come here and because that that kid's great, man. He's a lovely guy. Oh man, he's one of those kids, he's just like this little ball of energy that is super talented, you know what I mean. And um, I really would like to see him record in so many studios and become that recording artist, you know what I mean. So, and the only way you get that is I guess with recording in other people's studios, you know. You know what I mean? But um, no, I love working with him. Um, and then I'm working with a guy called Lockie or Lace, yeah. Um, and I'm doing some stuff with him as well. Um, I think he's mixing some of the songs here. Cool. I think Scott's got a few of them at the moment. Oh, see, unreal. Yeah, he's uh he's an epic talent, yeah. He's loving it. And then um I'm doing a couple of projects I can't talk about.

Jimmy 38:39

Um that's probably one of the ones I was actually about to ask you about, so we'll just yeah, yeah, I I can't talk about them.

Benny 38:45

Um but yeah.

Jimmy 38:47

Can we talk around them without talking about them? Yeah. So I remember because you put a post up where this is going in.

Owen 38:54

If we if we can always line here, I can always I want the magic man king edit out anything you want.

Jimmy 39:00

I mean, you can probably take it and edit it. But um, I remember you put a post up on your socials not long ago saying I'm getting to record like one of my teenage idols, or is that is this what you can't talk about? Yeah, one of the things.

Owen 39:14

Can I have a guess? Can I have a guess? Oh, yeah, you can male or female? Male. Oh fuck. Um fuck that through me because I was gonna say tana arena, so now I'm in the she's alright, man.

Jimmy 39:34

So without talk telling anybody who it is or you know, like the ins and outs of it, let's talk about how it feels to do something like that. That's great, man. So that that when when you get that phone call, the email, whatever it is to say, hey, we want to work with you, like you know what goes through your head, and then how do you kind of process that into then being able to go and work with this band that you've vitalised?

Benny 39:57

Um I I've I I wanted it, so it was like, oh wow, and when they asked me, it was more like we couldn't think of anyone better to do it with, which was kind of weird, you know what I mean? And then um obviously it's kind of funny because the project is taking a long time, but it's not the fact that we're recording lots, it's just we're doing it when we're in the mood for it. So um obviously these guys are probably they're a bit older than me, um, and they've haven't recorded they broke up and they haven't been together for a while, um, but now they're back together. And yeah, and basically they're um yeah, yeah.

Owen 40:32

Cogs at Cogsy. It's like broken up.

Benny 40:41

So anyway, short, it's it's basically when they can do it, yeah and and when they're not in the mood, we just say, hey, we're not in the mood. So I've kept it to a Sunday thing, you know what I mean? Where it's more like it's and it and we've made this recording more like a bunch of friends. Obviously, they do pay me, um, but it is we've made the session more like a um bunch of friends having a barbecue in the afternoon, and instead of keeping sitting down and playing a game of pool, we're sitting down and doing an album, you know what I mean? So sometimes one person can't make it, so we do other parts, um other times, but unfortunately doing it that way does take a long time. Absolutely, but you know, recordings aren't about the end result, are they? They're about the journey you did to get there. I think they're the best recordings as when you talk about the story in making them, I guess, you know. Yeah, I find making records is more fun than finishing them. So you know, um, but yeah, and I'm I'm loving working with them, and they're a great bunch of guys. And there's also another favourite band that I'm recording at the moment, too. And um doing both of them and loving them, you know. Um but I can't say the names because they've asked me to keep it quiet. Yeah, that's cool. Because they kind of want to just go, hey, here we are, you know, nice, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jimmy 41:49

And is is one of them is one of them overseas?

Benny 41:53

Yes, yeah.

Jimmy 41:54

Yeah, because I you you posted about I'd really I should get on a plane, but I'm not going to, I'm gonna do it from here. Yeah. So can you talk about how that process was? I know we've spoken to um uh Jason Jason in the past who gets you know, people record stuff, send it over to him, and he mixes. Is that is that kind of what you're doing? Is you are you're gonna be able to do that.

Benny 42:12

Yeah, we're doing it through Source Connect. Yeah, um, I learned Source Connect from a guy called Ryan Green, brilliant producer overseas um with the band the Guzzlers. Um, never went anywhere, but it was a fun project. Um and basically Matt Ryan and he put me on this uh program for Source Connect where you can work remotely, and basically your studio becomes a remote studio, and you just link them together and it's um and it's real time, there's no latency. I can't believe there's no latency, but it there is.

Owen 42:36

It's like audio movers on steroids.

Benny 42:38

Yeah, yeah, it's actually quite good. Um, and basically, yeah, you get full control over you know um the DAW and um we've been doing some remote projects with that, and it's been a great platform for it. Um, and then yeah, they've just been coming and going. They locked out my studio a week for a week, a couple of uh about a month ago, and they cut they flew over and did some stuff. Oh, cool. Um, told everyone do not turn up, do not come here, do not just turn because a lot of people turn up to my studio and um just for a beer or to say hello, but um, it was like don't turn up, it's very confidential, and yeah, we just worked together on it. And of course a couple of people did though, didn't they? Yes, yes, they did. Curiosity got the better of it. It's alright, you know, it worked out well in the end. So, you know, yeah, and that'll be finished in November, end of November of this month. Yeah, cool. Next isn't October, November. It's November, yeah, yeah. End of this month, it's finished. So I'm I'm just about to start doing the mix down on the project, and it's all tracked and all ready to go.

Owen 43:36

So it's just basically having a bit bit of a break, and I've got some catch up work to do, so I'll mix that down in the next couple of weeks and I always I love that little period in between tracking and mixing a project because I find that the day after I finish a project, and the project could have been like a single that was only a day, could be an album that was a couple of Weeks doesn't really matter how long it is. I find like I give it a day, I make sure I still have a girlfriend, get some real sleep, go and see the sun, and you know, do do normal people things, but then like the day after that, I I get like excited about opening the Pro Tools session again. I'm like, fuck yeah, I can't wait to mix it. Like I hope I hope the drums still sound good. Like I get really keen like after having that little break, but I you definitely need that little break to I don't know, like make you excited again or something.

Benny 44:31

Like it fucking well it also is a reset button too because you hear things from like a different point of view, you know what I mean? Like, and I won't I've got a set of headphones, these are these headphones, and what I'll do is I'll I'll just throw them on when I first jump back in to mix, you know. I mean, like when you start the mix, I'll just put them on and just press play, you know what I mean? Just sit back, close your eyes, have a beer and listen. You know what I mean? And just um, and then normally I track the next day, so I have that brief moment of I'm going to go in and listen to it, and then the next day make notes and then just hit it with the gr hit the ground running the following day, you know.

Owen 45:03

Um I don't know if that's how you do it too, but you know, it's just yeah, I um I always make sure I have obviously I have like a desk mix at the end of the session, and then I I will normally have a listen back to the desk and I'll be like, oh, this is pretty good, and then I'll start mixing, and probably like an hour, two hours into mixing, maybe I'll reference back to that desk mix and I'll be like, Alright, it's already way fucking better than that. Like, let's keep going. That sounds shit now. Let's keep going.

Jimmy 45:29

Yeah, yeah. Is it like um you know when you play like Mario Kart, you get the ghost? Do you like delete do you delete the old exactly what it's like? It catches up, takes over.

Benny 45:40

I hate that moment when you look at the mix and you've got playlists, you know what I mean? And and and and you open up the playlist and then you go, Oh shit, there was two mics there, which playlist was which?

Owen 45:49

You know, you I can I can help with that. Yeah, what target playlist do you use that? Yeah, target playlisting is the fucking saviour. Because then you know if you're looking at a little orange square, you're looking at the wrong thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, yeah, that has been uh that's been a godsend.

Benny 46:05

Yeah, yeah. Actually, the new Pro Tools updates have been quite good with multiple track markers and multiple lines. Like I'm I was a person that was about to walk until some of the new updates came out, you know what I mean? Like literally was about to walk from it until some of these new updates come out. Oh, the ARA stuff is ridiculous, isn't it? Even um just even some of the um the the alignment tools, like I like how they've got like because I don't know about you, but vocal align doesn't really work for me on a lot of things. Yes, you know what I mean. But then um the waves sync or whatever it is, that also works in the Pro Tools ARA as well. Um and then there's also uh auto align too. So between the three of them, um something works. Something works, you know what I mean? But one of them, I'm not saying any of them are bad, but I'm not saying any of them are particularly good either. It's just it's you know, sometimes this one will work, sometimes that one will work, but it's good that they're um it's really opened up. The ARA stuff is great with what they've opened up. It's about time I did stuff like that.

Owen 47:07

Absolutely, yeah, it's so great.

Benny 47:09

And voice to text is good too.

Owen 47:11

I tried that for the first time literally last week, and it was the fucking funniest thing. I yeah, I did it and I was like, this is weird, and I just kind of got rid of it, but I was like, yeah, it's yeah, yeah, sometimes it's good for queuing in stuff, you know what I mean, or where we're at.

Benny 47:24

Um and also having multiple, I don't know if you see the multiple markers now, but you can have so many markers to just like stickies on your tracks, you know, and that's huge for me, you know what I mean. And just just heaps of stuff. It's it's actually it's about time they you know made it a bit more brungled into this day and age, day and age, you know what I mean? Yeah, absolutely. Um, but yeah, other than that, it's it is what it is, it's DAW. Yeah, um yeah, and I I'm glad I didn't have to change because I've been using it for 25 years or something.

Jimmy 47:53

Yeah, wow, yeah. Yeah, I actually saw Ben's frustration growing and growing and growing on social media at one point. He's like, if I have to click okay one more time on this fucking box.

Benny 48:04

Oh, that was when the Mac M1 came out, and it was like they went, oh mate, yeah, yeah.

Owen 48:10

I I kind of accidentally played my cards kind of right in that changeover period. My laptop, which is sitting over there, was my mix that was my whole rig, was that, and that's got an i7 Intel chip in it. Yeah, and I that was like the last one they made with the Intel chips, and I had that up until this year, and it was running fine. It was getting a little bit tired on bigger mix sessions, but then I just bought a Mac Mini M4, and I got like the base model one, yeah, and it's fucking rocky.

Benny 48:41

I wish I didn't go M2, I wish I fucking waited too because I had an i7 and I was running that, and um literally when I first loaded up, things were going sideways, and um I I I'm not sorry if I'm allowed to say it, but I actually opened up their source code and fixed the fucking thing. Just just literally, I think Nathan was with me when I did it. Um I just got the shits that much that I got in there and fucking just put a fix in, you know what I mean, just to stop it from you know I mean, lock or locking out that function. So for a while there are certain certain couple of functions wouldn't work, yeah. But that's because I just locked out that because I'm just sick of it, you know what I mean? So and it worked for a little bit, and then um obviously the new updates fixed it all up. So but um but in saying that the new owners have made a good job, you know.

Owen 49:25

So which is surprising to be honest, because they got bought by like a big fucking like hedge fund kind of vibe, did they not?

Benny 49:32

Yeah, yeah, I think so, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think they got rid of the whole board of directors, man. I would have done that for doing for free. I would have gone and said, You're fired, you're fired, you're fired. Anyway, we shouldn't knock them because they are a good um you know the meat and potatoes of our industry. That's better now. It tastes better now, yeah.

Owen 49:56

Jimmy's per Jimmy Ted.

Jimmy 50:02

Uh so we've been talking about music for a for a while now. Um one question I always like to ask my guests is what keeps you going outside of music? I know for some people it's hard hard to answer because it is their life, but outside of music, Benjamin Pounder, what what keeps you happy?

Benny 50:21

What keeps me happy? Yeah. My family, man. Yeah, cool. My family, my friends, um my partner, Sam. Um, everyone, you know, um anyone that met Sam knows that she's a legend of a person.

Jimmy 50:32

Um she has to be to put up with you, right? Oh yeah, man.

Benny 50:37

Yeah, absolutely, man. Um, you know, and kids, grandum and granddad, so obviously Sam and my grandkids as well. Um they live in Gunnar, so it's a bit hard, but wow you know, um, but even even that. And um Do you get lots of photos of the dog on the tucker box? Uh Gunnar. Gunnar. I'm near Tamworth, mate. I'm near Tamworth, mate.

Nathan 50:56

I'm at Tamworth, mate. That's where he used to sneak over the Queensland border in in during COVID. There was a little track he could go away. Just quietly.

Benny 51:06

I make things. That's what keeps me going. Yeah. I make things. So I've built I just finished building these hybrid drum triggers. Cool. Um different to normal PZOs. Yeah. So I've made everything from the ground up, yeah. So super responsive, like with mesh heads gone through it all, worked them all out, and uh managed to get superior drummer really working like a real drum kit.

Owen 51:26

So it's is it's what uh what signal is being sent from the trigger? Is it sending um both?

Benny 51:31

I can go to a MIDI device, yeah, or I can plug it into an audio interface and then straight in as a trigger from Superior Drummer. But I've got the thresholds and gates that you know I've made. Um kind of hard to explain. You kind of want to try it for yourself to know you know, you know what I mean. Like I don't know about how much you've done with digital drum kits, but they can be a real pain in the world. Yeah, no, they definitely can.

Owen 51:54

I've spent a lot of time.

Nathan 51:55

He invented fucking he invented epic triggers, like informated them himself. Yeah, that's awesome. They were better than the Roland ones.

Owen 52:02

Yeah, those Roland ones are crazy. Those Roland ones are a punish.

Benny 52:06

Yeah, um, so yeah, um everyone that's used it has gone, wow, they like them, they like them, yeah. But that was like 10 years in the making. Wow, um literally. Um but yeah, just just stuff like that, like a built couple of little preamps here and there, and you know, little mixes here and there, and just sort of little things that solve property. Yeah, splitter boxes and solve problem solvers, you know what I mean? Um obviously having a studio, you know, sometimes you look at something and it doesn't work, you know what I mean. And then um, you know, I was looking at maybe building a um like a like a switchable patch bay, like the flocks or the uh wolfs, but um when I started looking to how much it was going to cost in relays and then time to make the boards and stuff, I just kind of looked at the price of the flocks. I went, you know what? It's actually quite cheap when you think about it.

Owen 52:49

Yeah, or you just looked at the price of some more bantam patch cables and you went, that's all right too. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Benny 52:54

Mind you, having the matrix, having a switchable patch bay is a total game changer for me, man. Yeah, for sure. I don't know, do you guys got a switchable patch bay yet? Or mate, I'm telling you now, like it that was literally that was like an o like an instantaneous being able to switch between different combinations of outboard gear without physically going to the patch bay. Yeah, that like it's it I I it it I it it it it saves hours. Yeah, does that make sense? Like literally hours because it it's um it literally is and especially in tracking. So I like to track with comp I don't know how you guys track, but um I love to track with compressors, I like to track with you know what I mean, different EQs. I like to I like to track go in wet, you know what I mean? Go in go in wet and just go in with what you want to try and minimize your mixing, you know, and and um you know sometimes it is good to flick between like a distressor and an opto compressor, or you know, or flick, okay, do I want the 1176 before or after? But just to go A B.

Owen 53:52

Yeah, that's pretty cool.

Benny 53:53

You know what I mean? When they're actually singing the take. So obviously your first run's a dummy take, but actually to be flicked through in real time while they're singing it, going, yeah, this works better. You know, you you know what I'm saying? Like that that is I think the the moment I went, I love switching patch bass. That's it. I mean, I don't think I'll ever go back to abandoned patch bass again after that, you know what I mean? Um but but yeah, um, and then from that, obviously gear was cold, but yeah, I I can't remember what we're talking about now. I went off fucking tangent. What makes me happy? I went back to T video again. I guess music makes me happy, you know.

Jimmy 54:33

So it's uh so um you said you're a granddad, that obviously means you've got kids because that's a pretty kind of influential kind of piece to that puzzle, right? Yeah, so have any of your kids followed in your footsteps as musicians or engineers or recording?

Benny 54:46

Thank God no. Yeah, I wouldn't wish this life upon anyone. I I I don't it's not a bad thing, I love it, but yeah, it's it it literally is um what do you call it? You leave your day job because you don't like the nine to five. 100%, but then you go into working 24-7, you know. It's um it literally is there's there's the work life balance is your work, you know. Um but yeah, no, I um my oldest daughter owns a couple of gyms. Um my second daughter is in uh doing neuroscience. Wow. Um my elder son's just finished his HSC, and my younger son is just starting in kindergarten.

Nathan 55:21

So yeah, but Maddie, Maddie, yeah, his his daughter daughter's a very, very good muse. She was she was sort of doing pretty good chops when she was about six years old. Yeah, yeah. So they're always hanging out in the studio and stuff. So oh yeah, they can play, like you know what I mean. But Jadis just mixed it, just popped out and and and mixed the link and pin, no worries. You know, yeah, he's eighty just finished his HSC, so yeah, yeah, yeah.

Benny 55:43

Oh Jadis has done a few mixing jobs, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Owen 55:47

The work life balance thing is funny. I had an interaction on um Sunday with the I think he's a golf pro, he's like about my age, down at the Everglades, and it was like uh 7 30 on Sunday morning and it was just drizzling a little bit, and I walked in. I was like, hey mate, how you going? He's like, Yeah, good, how are you? I was like, Yeah, fucking awesome playing golf. And he's like, it's I don't think I've ever been this excited to play golf. And I was like, You definitely have, Danny. I was like, you 100% have been excited to play golf. And he was like, Do you get excited when you walk into a studio? And I was like, not on Sunday morning at 7 30, but I bet you'd fucking get excited if you walked in there this morning. And he was like, Yeah, true.

Benny 56:26

And I was like, I I still love it, but yeah. Yeah, I love it too. Oh too, yeah. Yeah, I think I've learnt to try and avoid the people that make me not love it.

Owen 56:40

For sure.

Benny 56:41

Does that make sense? 100%. I think, and that's where I kind of like being older, yeah, and you know, like having other sources of income as well at the same time, you know, is is you're not bound to this is my job, you know what I mean, and dealing with certain attitudes and personalities, you know, and just dealing with people full of love and you know, and and those those sorts of people um end up becoming lifelong friends too, yeah, you know, and that's that's how I like to keep it, you know. Um that's that's important, you know. But um yeah, it's um and they respect your work life balance too, because they're the ones actually saying, Hey, you definitely take it this weekend off, aren't you? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm definitely taking you're not working on my project, are you? No, no, I'm working on somebody else's project, it's alright. Well no, they actually all say it to me because they all know each other too, they've all gotten to know each other through my place as well. So like a lot of the guys that come to the studio kind of get to know each other. So I have this little um once a month on Tuesday nights, um, little get-together that's sort of open for um people within the like you're welcome and you're welcome, but it's you kind of you know what I mean, it's it's only people welcome within the sort of the Benny sphere. The the the the the community, yeah, yeah. You can't just it's not a party, you know what I mean? Like it's more of just and and even that is more um it's more question and answer time too. Like it's it's like um like one artist came in one week and it's like okay, how do I get PPCA stuff sorted? You know what I mean? And it's like someone that's there going, hey, you do this, and then another guy came in and said, Hey, I've built this guitar pedal. Um, what do I do with it now? I can't get this to work. And I think I was pulling up to speak. He wants to speak to you soon, Benny. Yeah, I was pulling it apart and working with it, and then someone else is like, hey, I really am struggling with this recording. You know, it's one of those sorts of nights, you know what I mean. But um, yeah, yeah, it's um anyway. I've I've waffled on enough.

Jimmy 58:24

I what I sorry, I keep going off under tensions back to the we might be hosting the podcast, but it's all about you today, Benny's okay. Yeah, we want we want you to waffle on, yeah, man. Of course, it's course. We want you know, we want people to get a gist of who you are and what you do and what makes you tick.

Benny 58:40

And I don't exist.

Jimmy 58:41

Um you know, obviously you you're a massive part of my music journey, um, especially in my formative years, you know. Um always looked up to as a musician and somebody in the industry, and you know, one of these people as well that that has so much knowledge in the industry, and I I know you know a lot of people, don't get me wrong, but you you know, you're not world famous, Benny Pounder.

Benny 59:04

No.

Jimmy 59:04

For that, like, and that they're the people we want on here to to chat to. Like, you know, I've said this a couple of times, it might end up being a little catchphrase for the for the podcast, really. But you know, to get those three people up on stage, it takes thousands of people to through in that journey, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Even the mum driving into music lessons, the music teacher, the guys that set up the stages, oh yeah, the you know, hair cross, whatever. Like, and everybody has their stories, and that's that you know, and along that too, I'm trying to learn as much as I can along the way as well, you know. So hopefully, you know, the listener gets to learn a thing or two.

Benny 59:38

And music's an endless journey, isn't it? Like, yeah, you never get there. That's it, you never get there. It's just it's just the journey of just keep making music and having fun, you know. I mean, like it really at the end of the day, to make music is it's it's party to me, it's part of my soul, you know. You know what I mean? Like, I I can't like if if if I I I don't know how I could not listen to music or hear it or play it or record it. I I don't think I could go more than 48 hours literally um without it. You know what I mean. I think I went on a holiday to Bali and then find up finding a local jam place within three days. Started jamming, yeah, yeah. Um literally, but um yeah, I don't think and I think I'm sure you guys are the same. Yeah, but you're you know what I mean.

Jimmy 1:00:25

Oh, yeah, well I listen to music every day, I'll play it most days, yeah. No, 100%.

Benny 1:00:28

And making it's not necessarily about being famous or making money from it, it's about you know making it as actually finishing things. You know what I mean? If someone's finished their first project, they've made it because they've made it to their first milestone. You know, and if someone plays their first gig, they've made it to their first gig, you know what I mean? They're making it to their second gig, or they're making it to their biggest gig, or you know what I mean? Like so making it is literally milestones. You make a milestone, you know. You know what I mean? Like and and um you know you can meet artists that are one aria's and one you know Grammys or whatever, and they'll tell you the same thing. You know what I mean? It's it's literally a lot of people. Well they still play the first gig, didn't they? Yeah, they're still striving, you know what I mean? Like they're still trying, you know what I mean? It's it's it's and and people that are yeah, every everyone's still making it, you know what I mean? Like it's it's it's it's not it and that's what it's called making it. You know, it made it isn't a word, I don't think. You know what I mean? It's it's it's it's making it, you know. Um but that's my opinion of it. It's gotta be fun and it's gotta be real.

Owen 1:01:23

100%.

Benny 1:01:24

You know, and hopefully that you know, and it's and there's an awesome scene happening on the central coast at the moment. Absolutely. It's um it's there's something really special um happening, which I think's made it more fun. And I wasn't a local. Yeah, um, I've only been in the Central Coast for about five, six, I sorry, six, seven, seven years, seven, seven is eight years. Um and I didn't really come here to start a studio or anything like that. I kind of just fell into it um and having it here. But um the museos I've met along the way have I've met lifelong friends. This way, you know what I mean, and met great bands, and it's this got this energy, and and there's something brewing here. Like there's something really special about this area that's um and I don't think people realise how many musicians are in this area. So many like you you couldn't count, like there's enough to feed how many studios? Um five that I can think of without thinking of it. I can think of ten, yeah, you know, literally, it's ridiculous, and it's great because um they're all different and they're all places of art. And not I don't think I've ever heard someone say a bad thing about any of them, really.

Owen 1:02:31

Yeah, no, they all serve completely different purposes and they're all great for different things, they're all you know what I mean.

Nathan 1:02:37

There's no jealousy, like there's you go to Sydney sometimes, you know, that there's real jealousy, and there's like you know, it's hard to get into a certain venue, and even Newcastle in itself, it's hard to get into Newcastle, but Central Coast, they welcome everyone and they they all help each other out. So I found it to be pretty amazing in that.

Benny 1:02:52

Were we talking about the cow shed?

Nathan 1:02:54

Yeah, yeah, no, 100%.

Jimmy 1:02:55

See what I mean?

Benny 1:02:56

Yeah, no, it's not there's like a real cult starting here, you know what I mean?

Jimmy 1:02:59

Like it's um I see lots of similarities between the Lincoln Pin and the Cow Shed, like the Vine, you know, all the bands that play there, you know.

Nathan 1:03:05

Yeah, you know Duke?

Jimmy 1:03:06

Yeah, Duke down at the Kieran Burns.

Nathan 1:03:11

Yeah, he was one of the organizers originally organized of the cow shed.

Jimmy 1:03:14

Oh, I would have met Kieran, yeah. Well, he would have been a little bit older than me at the time, so yeah, yeah.

Owen 1:03:18

Yeah, did you see the Lincoln Pin got a shout out from Tim Rogers? Yeah, I saw that. Hey, how good was that?

Nathan 1:03:24

Yeah, man, it was unreal.

Benny 1:03:25

Yeah good on good on Tim for doing that too. And it's about time Millie and Adam got recognised for that sort of stuff, man. Absolutely, because the blood, sweat, and tears they've put into keeping that place going is unbelievable. And the and um the the even the st the the the energy they've created and the vibe they've created, plus they've kind of instigated friendships there just by having that venue, you know what I mean? Like I could, you know, you you could you I can guarantee if you've been there you've met someone there. Yeah, 100%. They're about to have it, yeah, for sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jimmy 1:03:53

We'll get him, we'll get him, we'll get Adam up here then as well. We should get him up there.

Benny 1:03:56

We should, man. Actually, those two well though those two could tell stories too. Adam's like like punk rock royalty.

Jimmy 1:04:02

Oh man, I was I was chatting to him chatting to him the other week down there, and you know, you kind of tell me the whole reason they did it is because pubs on the central coast didn't want to play the the acts that they the shows that they wanted to put on, you know. They're like, well, who's you know, what do they sing about and do they swear? And and he's like, Oh come on, man, just you trust me, just give us a spot and we'll we'll bring the people, it's all right, and you sell beers, you know what I mean? Like, and nobody would put them on. They were too scared of you know losing their loyal older customers because somebody said an F-word in the middle of the pub, you know. So he's just like, This place came up and we just jumped at it just so that we could have a venue for bands that we want to play. Like that's and that's it's such a you know, like every every time I go down there, there's you know, a band of 18-year-olds to a band of 50-year-olds playing down there. It's such a great, great vibe, different stuff on every night. Go check it out, support them. Yeah, absolutely.

Nathan 1:04:56

There's always an appreciative crowd, no, like that they it's because music's such a um subjective thing, you know. Yeah, the crowd, if there's it's a room full of punkers, if there's a someone playing like like dancy stuff or poppy stuff, yeah, they'll still get a good round of applause, you know.

Owen 1:05:11

And it's a place where people go and expect music as well, which is good. So more more open to it.

Benny 1:05:16

Yeah, and and the and the funny thing is is that's had a knock-on effect. Yeah, because other venues are starting to do it too, and that's you you know what I mean, and you're starting to see more pop in with live music. You know what I mean? I just hope um it maintains it. Yeah, you know what I mean, and I hope artists or musicians especially can get behind and unite, you know what I mean, and and really work together in trying to make because I mean it's got the potential to become a music hub of Australia if you wanted it to be. Yeah, I mean it's got the musicians, yeah, you know what I mean, and it's got the space and it's got the talent, you know what I mean? And it it's it's you know I mean that there is a there is there is something that could could happen, you know what I mean. But the thing is, it's about working together, you know what I mean.

Nathan 1:05:55

Yeah, Millie Millie was a um an editor of Juice magazine back in the nineties when I used to I used to work for Channel V and um host Channel V and I used to love going to her office because it was ACP building and it was also where People magazine was. So you see the models going that you know those I don't know how to describe them. I'm sure that will only get you back. I'm sure that won't get you too much. Every now and then the elevator went ping and gets you to walk out James Packer and Carrie Packers. So I've known Millie for a long, long time, and and they also started with Mark Fraser, who used to be right up there with Drum Media. Okay, John.

Jimmy 1:06:36

Drum Media was the best magazine ever. I remember getting drum media from what was that place you seen, Parramatta, the grunge store in Parramatta? Yeah, Mosh. Mosh will beat this. Yeah, Mosh. And there was Hammer House up the road, too. Go to Mosh and buy your your um concert tickets and pick up your drum media. That's right, that's right. Yeah. Your army pants and my three Nirvana t-shirts that I owned. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Benny 1:06:58

And you ran into about 20 people along the way when you were. Yes. I remember that.

Jimmy 1:07:02

My science teacher used to play the clarinet in Paramatamall. So Buskin. Yeah, he was like he was actually really, really good. But he looked like, you know that guy, you know the Smurfs? Is it Gargamel? The so he looked like him, right? And he'd play. I'd I'd hope he'll never listen to this, don't I? And he played He'd play the clarinet in Paramatum All. He was absolutely awesome, right? He was awesome. And I remember Dude, you'd have to get him for a track one day. Yeah, we should actually. And we you can't. You're the good clarinet. He was really good. I remember I remember being at school and giving him shit, right? Like as a teenager, but just and that's because you're a teacher. Like, no, and nothing.

Benny 1:07:43

I never gave shit to my teachers. I was an A-grade student, mate.

Jimmy 1:07:47

This guy, I'll tell you some stories about this guy. Um, but he was looking back, he was amazing, and you know, but he was doing that, and he knew that every single kid from that school walked through that mall. Yeah, and he still did it and he didn't care. So, you know, yeah, Gargamel, whatever you know, I forget your name. Mr. Thornton, Mr. Thornby, Mr. Thornton, something like that. You're a legend. Good work, son. Um, so Benny Pounder, I've I'm gonna tell this story again. Right. You're on the podcast this time. Uh so Benjamin Pounder as a teenager was the sweetest young boy you could ever meet. There you go. He might not have looked it, but he definitely sounded it. And for my mum, that's all she needed. I remember this guy on numerous occasions coming around to my house to pick me up in that in that little the in the band van. What was it, the U-van or Suzuki caravan?

Benny 1:08:36

It was like the mini van. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was like a go-kart on wheels, yeah.

Jimmy 1:08:40

Knocking, knocking on the door with his with his best phone voice. Good afternoon, Mrs. Wallace. I'm Benjamin Pounder from the local youth group. And uh, we got this venue down at the cowshed, we're taking the kids down there. We won't be able to get them home, so you will have to pick them up around 9 30, 10 o'clock, whatever the ending time was.

Benny 1:09:01

That's right.

Jimmy 1:09:01

Right? But we're not many kids. Yeah, on the cans by then, but happy to get them all down there for you. So, anyway, Benny would do his trips, knocking on everybody's door, and I don't think there was a mum that never let their kid get in this guy's car, which is pretty fucking scary when you think about it. I was only 17 at the time. Well, the 90s was the 90s wasn't. I was 17, yeah. But the minute we got in that car, the debauchery started. And that, like, for me, I won't mention what we did because you know there's you just use your imagination. You're making me add to sound like No, no, no, no, no. What Benjamin never provided the debauchery, he just drove us to the places where debauchery could happen. Does that make sense? But anyway, as teenagers, you know, we'd steal beers off her parents and whatever. And but like that was you know, they are they were the fun times, they're those those core memories that you hold on to for the rest of the time.

Benny 1:09:50

Oh gosh, we got the strum trouble back then. Oh, yeah.

Nathan 1:09:56

Best time, best times though, hey. Oh man, for sure. We were lucky to we were lucky to grow up in those times. Yeah, we were.

Benny 1:10:01

Oh man, but the thing is there was no internet, there was no social media. So what what what happens, you know, the amount of times you used to get drunk um, you know, out in a field somewhere and just like I don't know how we're still. Yeah, literally a field, like you know, and there'd be like 200 kids with like Western Sydney was different to a lot of other places because especially areas like Northmead and Grace Danes and things like that, back in the 90s it was like bugger all public transport. Yeah, you know what I mean? Um, it was sort of the era of the Australian the recession Australia had to have sort of shit, you know what I mean? And like literally there was like no public transport, so you you either got somewhere by bike or someone you knew had a license and drove, you know what I mean? And what I used to have was to get people to places, no one got I think that was the early one was you figured out if I could go pick everybody up, then I could drink, but they've got to get their own way home. And a lot of people didn't go home. I think there was a lot of people that slept in that park for that week.

Jimmy 1:11:03

I think it was people that slept at the cow shed too in that and every now and then I used to go for a swim at when he pulls as well.

Benny 1:11:08

Yeah, yeah, for a shower, yeah, clean, you know. Yeah, that's right.

Nathan 1:11:12

That wasn't down that that canal down the back of Toon Gabby, was it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I've heard stories about that place.

Jimmy 1:11:23

Well, guys, I think we've um kind of had a good chat, covered a lot of what I wanted to talk about, and I mean there's nothing stopping us from ever having another chat down the line to you know, talk again. But um the way I like to close out every podcast is by first thanking the the Grove and the Grove the Grove Studios and the Grove Studios Academy for helping me out with the podcast, and then asking you to recommend me a song to listen to on the way home.

Benny 1:11:49

Um a good one or a bad one?

Jimmy 1:11:51

Whatever you want. Keep the floors open. We're gonna we're gonna close the podcast out with a with a little snippet of this song, and everybody else is gonna be able to hear it too.

Benny 1:12:00

Oh, on the spot.

Nathan 1:12:02

Um you don't pick mine.

Benny 1:12:10

Um if it's one song, I can't pick if it's something I've done, I can't pick because I've got so many artists that I've worked with that I could pick a hundred.

Jimmy 1:12:21

Oh, it doesn't have to be something you've done, it can be anything.

Benny 1:12:23

Um pick a song. Yeah. Something from yesteryear's?

Jimmy 1:12:26

From yesterday. From yesterday's yesterday.

Benny 1:12:28

Yesterday's. Dead Kennedy's. Dead Kennedy's? Yeah, I fought the law. There you go. Dead Kennedy's.

Owen 1:12:33

I don't think you ever took that Dead Kennedy shirt off, did you? No, that's there's something rips and all that. Was it like a holiday in Cambodia one? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Old man has the same one and they uh he still wears it on special occasions because it's about fucking well, you could see through the fucking thing.

Benny 1:12:47

Yeah.

Owen 1:12:47

Um yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Benny 1:12:49

Something weird, yeah. Dead Kennedy's, you know, um, yeah, I fought the law. There you go. Nice.

Jimmy 1:12:54

Awesome.