The Intro with Jimmy and Owen

Hello listener, I am very pleased to share with you The Intro Episode of Welcome to studio 2. In today's episode I (Jimmy) will be chatting with Owen Butterworth, Studio Manager, Producer, and Engineer. Join us as we chat about the premise of the podcast, a little about our formative years, then get stuck into Owen's role at the studio and what keeps him ticking. Lots of good music chat, and lots to learn 

Exit Music (For A Film)                                                                                           Preformed by: Radiohead                                                                                         Written by: Colin Greenwood, Ed O'Brian, Jonny Greenwood, Phillip Selway, Thom Yorke                                                                                                                          Produced by: Colin Greenwood, Ed O'Brian, Jonny Greenwood, Phillip Selway, Thom Yorke, Nigel Godrich                                                                                                   Source: XL Recordings

Better Not Bitter                                                                                                     Preformed by: Cosmic Psychos                                                                               Written by: Cosmic Psychos                                                                                                  Produced by :Cosmic Psychos                                                                                                Source: Cosmic Psychos 

Playlist of songs or bands mentioned in todays episode https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5pidyLH5j2NjRggIYTrag1?si=8586e27647f74a9a&pt=2feaca9a4fc30ec278d4b4d5a3221229

welcome to Studio 2
https://www.instagram.com/welcometo_studio2?igsh=OXJyOGcxMTJveHhj&utm_source=qr

Owen Butterworth

Transcript

Jimmy 0:01

Fuck yeah. So hey guys. We're in studio two today at the Grove. I'm Jimmy, and across from me is Owen Butterworth. Hey Owen. Hey, how are you? I'm good, how are you? So good. So uh we're starting a podcast up here at the Grove. Um and Owen and I are gonna be working together a bit. And I mean I've known Owen for quite a few years now, but really I just know Owen is uh my contact up at the Grove. I don't I don't really know much about Owen personally. So today we're gonna sit down and have a chat and we're gonna get to know each other so you guys can kind of learn a bit about us as well. Um so moving forward, this podcast might might make a little bit more sense. How does that sound? Perfect, sounds great. So I'm Jimmy, but I'm James. Yep, that's what my mum calls me. Um a few people call me that. Um and you're Owen. I'm Owen, yep. So Owen, where do you come from? Where are you a coasty?

Owen 1:01

Are you yeah, I'm born and raised coasty. Yeah, yeah, Gossford Hospital, baby. Yeah, no. Um yeah, I grew up here on the coast, went to um went to school here, and yeah, it's it's pretty weird. I always think I when I decided that I wanted, you know, music production and and audio engineering to be my career path. I always thought for sure to work at like a big studio or to work with big bands or to do any of that stuff. I had thought minimum I'd be moving to Sydney and then probably Melbourne. And then when I learnt about the grove, I was like stunned. I was like, oh, that's what's behind that big piss-off rock wall on the road that I learned to drive on is. Like it's so it's so weird to like I l at the moment I live seven minutes from here and I my family, my my childhood home was like 15 minutes from here. So it's it's ridiculous, but it's awesome and I love it. It means that I um I don't know, I feel this like I obviously I feel like a a big connection to the area, and I love being involved with like the community stuff that we do, whether it's like sponsoring events or battle of the bands or you know, doing stuff with the Central Coast music community. I feel like I love doing that stuff, um, and that's because I was, you know, I was a kid playing gigs around the coast, um, and you know, doing all of that stuff as well. So I know exactly what it's like for for the kids that are doing it now.

Jimmy 2:23

Yeah, cool. So you said you were a kid um playing gigs, like how how old were you when you started A, playing music and then B kind of performing?

Owen 2:34

I I've always been I was always into music as a kid. My dad, well both my parents are big music lovers, neither of them play instruments. Um, but you know, there's family videos of me dancing around the house as a toddler to Mr. Bungle and the Coyote Ugly soundtrack and like all of that shit. Um I I think when I was like seven or eight, I really wanted guitar hero for Christmas, and then my parents got me a real guitar, and I was like, fine. I wanted the video game, but the real thing's alright, I guess. Um and I started playing guitar then. Um and I had guitar lessons for a few years, and then I sort of at the start of high school, semi kind of wasn't interested that much in playing music anymore, and then I picked it up again around year like you know, middle high school, like year nine, started playing again, and that's when my friends started playing as well, and then we started jamming a music class, and yeah, so sort of around then is when I started um performing music, and it would it'd be around then that I started getting into the idea of like audio engineering and and music production as well. I had um I was one of those kids that would be up the back of the hall during assemblies and shit and like mix the bands that we play and do the lights and all of that stuff, um, which is yeah, where I where I got the interest, I suppose, and then that kind of carried all through high school, and I I made shitty demos by myself in my bedroom with a cracked copy of Ableton and um recorded my friends' bands in their house on school holidays and stuff like that. Um, so yeah, doing all of that through high school, and then um, you know, towards the end of high school, I I was also like a drama kid. I did drama in high school as well. I thought I wanted to work in live sound or in a theatre and doing sound for musicals or you know, working at a concert hall and somewhere like you know the N-more theatre or something like that is what I thought I wanted to do. So I started studying at JMC in the city, um, which was great. And sort of to how no it wasn't really long into the degree, I started studying in the February. Um I think it was April, an internship opportunity came up here at the Grove, and I came and interviewed for it, and I got the internship. I think I started in May. Um, and literally on my second day interning, I had this crazy experience. Just I was fortunate enough to be a fly on the wall to watch Scott recording vocals with Birds of Tokyo, and they were doing that song, that Good Lord song, um, which you know is all about heartbreak and infidelity, and just the care that was taken by all of the band and Scott to get you know Kenny the lead singer through this really cathartic and emotional and hard experience in the studio, and I was literally sitting in the back of the room holding my breath, like choosing when to breathe and like trying not to move and like just trying not to be noticed. Um, so I could just yeah, watch this thing unfold. And Kenny killed the vocal, got an awesome vocal, and you know, he comes back into the room and everyone gives him a big hug. And I was like, fuck working in live sound, I want to do this, and I want to work in a music studio and I want to make music. So um kept my head down as an intern, kept doing KFC runs and teas and coffees and raking of driveway.

Jimmy 6:05

So make a good coffee.

Owen 6:06

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I always say that I should have come away with a cert three in hospitality or something after an internship. But um, yeah, just did all of that stuff and then got the tap on the shoulder at around Christmas time of that year um to assist on my first session. I jumped at the opportunity and I've yeah, then I became the studio manager uh sort of 18 months after that, which was the start of COVID, which was just insane. It was like, yeah, here's here's the role of managing the music studio, and then like the whole world collapses, which was was pretty mental. Um but it was it was great to you know it was definitely a learning experience, um figuring out how we operate and you know where what we're doing and how we're getting bands up here and getting through that. Feels it's super back to normal now, and it has probably been for 18 months, but yeah, it was it was crazy to go into a role having expectations of one thing and then just all of that being thrown out the window for you know, everyone's job completely changed. So yeah, it was interesting to do, but um everything's back to normal now, which is great.

Jimmy 7:19

It is good. Well, I mean the the whole I mean not the I the idea behind the podcast, but for me the premise behind the the podcast probably started during those COVID times as well. Um I used to hang hang out with uh one of my really good mates. Uh I went to school with these Benny Bands his whole life and always played gigs most weekends and as COVID came along and the whole music scene shut down you know like it was it was hard for him. Um obviously, you know, not playing shows, not playing live all the time. So we actually uh started chatting um once a week. We'd we'd get on Zoom and we'd have these long in depth kind of meaningful DNMs that would would would go for hours, but on top of that we'd uh talk a lot about music. And I suppose that's where for me my uh my love of uh learning about music really comes from. Like I've always been interested in music growing up, uh non non-musical parents, but we always had instruments in the house. So we had a piano and you know there was an old guitar and a did-roo-doo there, like we're you know, and encouraged to to muck around with them. And um for me it was uh a family friend, I was about 11 years old, uh came away on holidays and brought his guitar. And um just like sitting there watching him play, you know, like wow, this is this is so cool. Taught me four chords it was the G, the D, the A minor, and a C. But that's all we need on that knocking on Heaven's door. And I think I played that song literally for a year. Like, I don't think there was anything else I played, I just played that. Yeah, and then the next Christmas holidays when we caught up with him, he's sitting there and he goes, You know, you can play other songs, right? Didn't even occur to me. So, you know, like I've been playing music for a long time now, but really for me, um music was always just a bit of fun. Like I've I've I've I've been in a band um in the kind of late like 2006 to 2010. I was in like a stoner rock band. Sick. Um we mostly played in the garage and played a few, you know, Wednesday night, Thursday night gigs around Sydney. Um we had a lot of fun doing it. Um recorded four songs. Like, so you know, it's been there. I've kind of done a little bit, but nothing like what you guys do here at the Grove.

Owen 9:43

Where'd you record the four songs?

Jimmy 9:44

Uh we were at um Zen Studios in PC. Oh classic, yeah.

Owen 9:48

I think I think you've told me that. Yeah, I that I that place is crazy. It looks like it looks like a laser tag place on the inside. Yeah, it's like the little warehouses like running, yeah. Yeah, but I'm a massive plane nerd, so I love I've only been down there for one, I've thought maybe I've been down there twice, once for like a pre-pro and once to rehearse with a band. But it's like right by the airport. So the planes coming over the top are fucking insane. Yeah, it's awesome.

Jimmy 10:14

Yeah, and it was and like you know, we we set up, we just did a a live recording, you know, like we weren't just spending day while we were down there for a day and kind of pumped out four songs, and then a friend of mine, um Mark Raprager, who's actually my mate who I was speaking to during these uh COVID times, he he mixed it for us and kind of put it together. And oh, you know, like we we had a lot of fun doing it, but for for us it was they just you know, four mates from school kind of got back together in our 20s and late 20s and just started jamming in the garage and then went, well fuck it, let's play a few shows. And I had a great time doing it. Um, but you know, my my calling was being an electrician, and uh that kind of took me away from um as a profession, um took me away from from music, I suppose, a little bit. Um not something that I'd say that I'd I regret, you know, I don't live with regrets or anything like that, but it was just the the way the the world ended up working. Um but I suppose now, you know, I'd I was really lucky enough to sit in last week with uh Tori and Matt in the studio, and just you know, similar experience of being a fly on the wall, I suppose you could say, where I'd sat there and Tori was doing some stuff with a harmonica and doing some harmonies on her vocals, and you just sit in there going, wow, and I like even watching Scott on the computer just do his little thing, you know, like bang, bang, bang, bang, bang. Yeah, and then honestly, the next day I was listening to a a song on Spotify, and I'd I saw Scott's fingers move on a computer and a little part come out of the song get put here and there. I was like, that's magic, like it's just but the way you know it blew 100% blew my mind of by just sitting there and watching how how you know Tori did her thing and how Scott did his thing, and then it creates this like this magic, like it's it is, it really is. Um it's you know, you're lucky to experience that every day, yeah.

Owen 12:12

100%, and I mean I think it's really cool the different ways that I guess music can be created because those, you know, when you've got like kind of a solo artist and a producer relationship, that's great, and that's really cool. I also love I guess kind of the setting that you were more familiar with. Like I love kind of being in a position where I'm being more of an engineer than I am being a producer, and I've just got four people in a room playing music, I've put some microphones in front of them, and they're gonna play their songs. Like that is super, super fun to me as well. Um, and yeah, I mean, one of my one of my favorite sessions every year is I often work with this band called Lion Island, and they're just they're all from the coast, they're from like around Kielcare. Um, and they're all great mates, they're all dads. Um, and they come up and we do two days in the studio and they play their songs, we record it all straight to tape. We do like ten songs in two days, it's like four tags of a song. Yeah, take three was the best. Alright, move on, keep going. And it's so sick. Like, I'm you know, my job is to make them sound good, so I put the mics in the right spots, I tune the drum kit, I make sure everything's hitting the board properly, I make sure everything's going to tape properly. Um, but I'm not directing them how to play, like I'm not reinventing the song, I'm not inventing parts, uh, I'm not moving bits around. Um, so being a producer in that sense, I also think is so awesome. And is I guess we're fortunate up here as well because we have you know a stupidly big studio that bands can come in and and do that and set up like they would at Zen Studios or set up like they would in their garage or in their bedrooms or whatever. Um so I always I always love that element to it as well, where you don't you don't have to be a musician to be a producer, you're just an audio engineer, or you're just a producer, or yeah, that's always super fun to me as well.

Jimmy 14:25

Yeah. So that was a nice little thing you said at the end there, you don't have to be a musician to be in uh a producer. I'd I would assume that most music producers would also be m musicians. Is that uh would I be wrong in assuming that?

Owen 14:38

No, not at all. I mean they definitely are now as well, because um, to be honest, the only one that I can think of off the top of my head that isn't is Rick Rubin. Uh he's like the obvious choice as well. But even if you think of people like he did play in a band, didn't he?

Jimmy 14:54

Wasn't he some bass player in some shit band in and then he left that to Oh maybe okay?

Owen 14:59

Yeah, I don't know, but I mean, yeah, when you think like classically of like because I'm pretty sure George Martin, you know, the Beatles trees, he had like composition skills and organized all those amazing string arrangements, and you know, now producers have to do everything, they have to be able to mix, they have to be able to engineer, they have to be able to program beats, they have to wear, you know, you go back 30, 40 years, there's like a different person to do each one of those jobs as recording budgets were bigger back in the day, and now with you know pretty tight budgets, the producer is the engineer and the assistant and the tape op and the fucking yeah, like the barista, yeah. I mean, which is which is fine, and you know, it just means that we have a broader skill set, um, I suppose. Um, but I also love I I um I do definitely love being able to just hone in on one of those things as well. Like I love I love days when I'm purely an audio engineer and someone else is calling the creative shots, or I love it in the opposite direction as well, when I don't have to be standing at the console and I can just be thinking about the songs and the structure and other things like that. Um so yeah, when when there's like I we do it, there's a couple of ways that it I've found myself in those situations, whether it's working under a producer like Scott and I'm audio engineering, or I've done the same thing for like Adam Spark as well. Um, or um Tom, who I work with all the time, and he's my business partner. We have a tag team set up as well, whereas you know, in writing sessions, he'll be sitting at the console and sitting at Ableton and programming the beats and you know doing all that stuff, and then when it comes to recording, it's a bit of a flip. I'll be at Pro Tools and at the console, and he'll be you know up the back of the room doing the big picture creative stuff, which is great as well. So yeah, it's it's good to still try and have a team um as much as possible, but you know, when you're it's just you and the artist, you just thug it out as well.

Jimmy 17:09

Yeah, yeah, nice, and so um obviously I know you I know you're a musician. Are you currently in a band yourself?

Owen 17:17

No, not really. Tom, who I mentioned before, he and I we before we were before I mean yeah, before we were like production partners and and business partners, we had a band together. Um we don't really do, we don't release anything under that anymore because we love writing music, love producing music, hence why we do it all the time for other people now. But releasing music and all of that shit around it is not fun and sucks, and I'm not into it at all. Like I hate trying to market myself, and I hate trying to get people to come to shows or buy records or streaming music or fucking do all of that. So uh writing music for other people is way more fun, and also uh we both uh session museos for other people as well, and we'll we'll play in their bands, and you know, if someone needs us for guitars or bass or whatever, we'll do that as well. We've done it with a couple of different bands, and we did one recently together. Tom was on electric, I was on acoustic, and we're playing country music, and it was sick. I've never played country music before, and it was so much fun. We played um that Grent Glenworth Grazing festival down in Glenworth Valley, and it was so cool. It was like, yeah, we played at 10 o'clock in the morning with this artist her name's Arabella, and I thought 10 o'clock in the morning set, like no one's gonna be here. It was freezing down at Glenworth Valley, and we get on stage, 10 o'clock rolls around, we start playing, and people just started pouring in. Like, I guess it's one of those festivals where it's like it felt like a food and wine festival with music. So, I mean, everyone just like was rolling in, putting up their camp chairs, and by like 10, 10, 10 past 10, there were like heaps of people everywhere, and it was great, it was so much fun. We played for like 45 minutes country music and then went and drank beer, so it was great.

Jimmy 19:11

That was pretty cool. So you said to me just then that you've um you've never played country music before, and and here you are just going up on stage playing country music for the first time. I mean, as somebody who's who's played for a while, it's you you know you can learn a song pretty quick. But how do you go from never playing country music before to to performing it?

Owen 19:29

Like I I don't know, I just kind of I've been listening to a lot of country even prior to getting the call up to doing the gig. So I was kind of I don't know, I was across it and I've been playing, you know, Willie Nelson and shit on my guitar because that's the best thing to do. Um and then Tom got caught up to play electric and I was like fantastic, and then Arabella had a different acoustic player lined up and they fell through, and then Tom was like, Do you want to do it? And I I will I am a shit guitar player, like that is I I suck as a guitar player. Um I can play all the chords and I can play I can play rhythm guitar fine. Um, but I said to Tom, I was like, Oh man, I don't know, like I feel like it'll be above my pay pay grade, and he's like, Bro, it's country music, it's four songs and a dream. And I was like, you know what? You're dead right, let's do it. And we're we're really fortunate, like Arabella, she is a fantastic singer, and her the songs that she's got are great. Um and then we had Harry Duff, who also works here at the Grove, and he's a he's a weapon of a drummer. Um, and then Riley McGuinness, I believe. Riley, yeah, I think that's his name, Riley McGuinness. He's a freak of a bass player that lives here on the coast as well. So I, you know, uh everyone else in the band was like uh as far as I was concerned, I was the weak link. Like everyone was seasoned fucking professionals. So me just playing four songs in my four chords on my acoustic for each song, and I just I just practiced like a motherfucker as well. Like I wrote all my own charts and um practiced every night, and then we rehearsed like three times, I think, or maybe twice as a band, and then went and played the gig and it was great, it was good fun. Cool.

Jimmy 21:12

So I asked you another question then. What what makes country music country music? Like I know um for me I I play a lot of blues, so you know we we only really need to worry about four chords because we just play the one, the four, the five, and mix them around a little bit. But like when when you hit when you're hitting country, we where does the fourth chord come from for for those of us that aren't familiar?

Owen 21:32

I don't know. I guess I don't know. I remember when I was at uni, I had this great lecturer, his name was Tom Hogan, and he won he did this whole lecture on like what is country music, and you know, he starts with like traditional kind of folk songs, like you know, Woody Guthrie, and then into like Bob Dylan, and then you know, extends that into like how do we get From you know bluegrass music and and you know a couple of people standing around one microphone and doing everything live, and then we go to someone like you know Hank Williams, or how do we get from that to Miley Cyrus and Shania Twain and Keith Urban, like how and you know, even now like Morgan Wallen, like how do we have trap hi-hats and he's talking about drinking beer and pickup trucks and and you know, like how do you put yeah, how do you put Willie Nelson and Morgan Wallen both in country music? Yeah, it's it's insane. Yeah, um, so I don't know, I think the what resonates with me in country music in particular, and I I suppose in all music to be honest with you, is like if something feels like authentic and honest, then I'm more drawn to it. Yeah. Um like yeah, if something feels real and right, um then I'm I'm more into that. And I think I think that there had there's a tendency for that in country music as well. Um something like Morgan Wallin doesn't really appeal to me because I don't I don't get the like the hip-hop influence that then leaks into country like that doesn't make any sense to me. Same with like shaboozy, you know, that um that bar song.

Jimmy 23:29

Yeah, or even um for me it was when Beyonce released the country album. It's not the country.

Owen 23:35

Like there was one song that's playing and then like you kind of destroyed Blackbird, so yeah, and also that doesn't feel authentic either, like Beyonce doing country is that doesn't make any sense at all. So yeah, uh yeah, so I don't I don't really know how to define it, I guess, but um yeah, I mean it's it's like anything, like you know, even I feel like even bands like Kings of Leon, you know, border that country thing, even though it's like alternative rock, it just kind of you know it when you hear it. That sounds so dumb to say.

Jimmy 24:12

I get what you're saying. I get what you're saying. Um I play this great game, I might have mentioned it to you before, it's called Music League. And I essentially long story short, you you get it given a category, you've got to submit a song. Um Spotify then generates an anonymous playlist so you don't know who's submitted what song. Yeah, you listen to that song over the week and then you vote on it. So you've got like a little League Happening Music League. Yeah, um, great fun game to play. Uh you kind of you find a lot of new songs through that. Um obviously, when you've got 20 people in a playlist submitting songs to a playlist, not everybody listens to the same kind of music. So you know you get the one guy that does the reggae song every week, and um there's always like a you know a song with a kind of a country vibe on there. And to be honest, there's some really good stuff that that I've heard. I I'm I like more of that probably that southern bluesy country sound more than you know, more than the the full kind of Tim McGraw. Yeah, I got a barbecue sand on my white t-shirt. Like I I mean, you know, it has its place, I'm sure. Um but it's kind of not for me. But anyway, like I do like that kind of hard rock country style that's kind of around. Um love that. Um feels feels good when you listen to it.

Owen 25:38

Yeah. Fucking oath. Um, I was gonna ask you something and I've completely forgotten it.

Jimmy 25:46

Um yeah, the musically thing, how many people play? So, I mean, uh the beautiful thing about you can make up your own league, so you can kind of set set the rules a little bit. So we have I like like if you've got more than 20 20 people in it, your playlist is too long, right? Right. Because you've got like a two-hour playlist you have to listen to to vote. So I mean you kind kind of can skim through and go, well, I know those 10 songs, so what don't I know? And but for me, I get to listen to music all day at work, uh, you know, working on construction sites. We just plug it in and I just put it on and make everybody else listen to it. And yeah, sometimes every what's that? What's that? You know, and you gotta kind of go back to your phone and listen to it. What came on the other day um on one of my music leagues? It was uh Cosmic Psycho's song. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Better not bitter. Nice, yeah, yeah, yeah. Man, that was so good. Everyone at work's like, what's this? And I'm like, it's fucking bullshit, uh, that's what it is. So do you play do you play with your mates or do you play with randoms? Uh uh, so I've got I'm in a couple leagues, so I've got one league, it's like a random from people all over the world. Like that's like, and then I've got a league that's mates, and then I've got a league that's we've got like all my cousins, so sick. Uh, you know, there's probably 13 or 15 of us in each of those leagues, and so every week I've got three playlists that I've got to listen to, and um and you know, either make wise or dumb decisions on how I'm gonna vote on that. But it's you can play it fun, you can play it seriously. For me, I like playing it to to hear stuff that I've never heard before, or that I wouldn't consider so we had a round the other week, it was Captain Planet round, right? So any song that has Earth, Fire, Wind, Water, or Heart in it. So you're gonna surely you put Earth, Wind, and Fire in You want to try to stay away from the obvious stuff, right? Because you you know you wanna you wanna introduce somebody to a song, right? You um and that's the way I kind of look at it. So what'd you put in? I put in a song called Rain by Vonderhorse, yeah, right, nice. Yeah, um, it didn't do too well. I don't really care about the the points on it. For me, it's you've never heard of this band, go listen to them. Like there's uh there's a cool new band to listen to. So I I play it that way. So if you give me a song I've never heard before, um you generally I'll give you all my points. That's the way I work. Nice. Um, and you know, the stuff like even some of the absolute classics, um you just gotta like if you hear it every day on the radio already, like I don't that's that's already in my frame of reference. Like, gotcha, give me something new. So that's the way I play the game. So for anyone that's gonna listen to this that plays musically, put some new shit on, eh? Um, and yeah, but it's it's it's really fun, like it's and it's an awesome way to find new bands, it's an awesome way to find new music, it's an awesome way to share your music that you like with other people as well. Yeah. Um so that every week do you get like a topic? Yeah, so there's a new there's a topic every week. You can create the topics. Music League has categories you can choose, or you can make up your own. Um like we've had some pretty crazy, you know, you can do anything from a song starting with this letter to Yeah, right, you know, like politically based songs or gotcha. Um anything like make up a category, you can find a song about it.

Owen 29:02

That's sick.

Jimmy 29:02

That's it's like uh it's like super coach or fantasy football for 100% but from music, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's a it's it's a fun little game. Um not affiliated with the podcast, but it could be first sponsor would be mad.

Owen 29:17

Why not? Yeah, fuck yeah. So I it's I love that you know you are a sparky by trade, and music is music is like your outlet, right? Like your downtime, it's your way to recharge and unwind and and reset.

Jimmy 29:35

Definitely, yeah.

Owen 29:36

Um, all of those things.

Jimmy 29:38

Uh it's therapy, it's um like a boredom killer, um it's stimulating, like you know, stimulates like trying to figure out a song that you think is out of your league. Do you know what I mean? Like, oh how am I ever gonna play that? And then nailing it, you're like, fuck yeah. Like recently had that experience with Paranoid Android. Felt great to get that opening guitar. How is it like sometimes you're trying to get a little and you're like, you it's not that hard, it's only this. It's I just can't do it, I can't do it. And you do it a hundred times and it gets worse and worse and worse, and you put it down the next day. You walk in, you just like, yeah, got it. Nice baby, yes. Like, I love that stuff about music. I love challenging myself with music. Uh, even for me, I played music for about 20 years without really knowing much about theory at all. Just tabs and chords, and I knew all the chords, and I could do that, and like you know, I could go on YouTube and learn a song off YouTube or get the tablature and I actually found um I used tablature for years and years and years, and YouTube came along and I was like, oh, this guy can teach me in like three. So how am I gonna bloody go? And then I went back to tablature and I'm like, I can't even read this shit anymore. This is crazy. Like so for me, I've actually trained my ear now where I mostly play by ear. One of my favourite pastimes is to just put on a random Spotify playlist and just have my guitar sit in there, and when a song comes on, try to figure it out by the time it's done. Mad. Um, not saying I play it perfectly, but I pick up the chord structure, play around with a little bit.

Owen 31:16

Great.

Jimmy 31:16

If I like that, sometimes I might even pause it and try to figure out a way to play that in seven different triads, like just to fuck around with it. Fuck yeah. Um, so you know, like I'd I'd you know, I love messing around and my knowledge is growing day by day by day by day. Like five years ago, I didn't know that every major chord had a relative minor chord.

Owen 31:38

Yep, sure.

Jimmy 31:38

Uh and now I was when I found that out, I was like, oh, so I actually already know. Yep, bang. Oh overnight, when you understand those, like, you know, well, overnight you get better. Like when you understand these concepts of music theory. I don't think you need to personally have to go to university and do a master's degree in music to understand music theory. I think no. I think you can understand like the you know, the the very simplistic basics of music theory pretty easily. Yeah, but it took me 20 years of playing guitar to realise that I understood so much more than I thought I did, and then really that opened up the floodgates for me to pretty much be able to play whatever I want, really. Um like there's some crazy, I still don't know where to play diminished chords, but we'll talk about them. Yeah, nice sick, but you know, it's understanding a little bit more and more and more and more of that music theory actually improved my playing ability, I believe, sure tremendously. And even to the point where like I walked into a room with three guys that I'd never met before, and within three minutes we were we were just jamming and we jammed for two or three hours. Like, I'd start just playing some chords and they'd pick it up. Somebody else would start playing something, I'd pick it up, like you know, as you said, it's you know, three chords in a dream sometimes, like it doesn't have to be hard. And from those three chords in a dream, there's a you know, there's so much you can do with it. Um so yeah, for for for me, and I suppose this is where this podcast has come in, like you know, I want to I want to learn more and more and more. Like just sitting in that studio once and seeing that, like I was the next day I heard a song and I was like, Oh, I can see that happening here as I can see that happening on the computer as well as happening in real life, like um and that was just one session, you know. Like, and so I'm I don't know, I just I'm a sponge at the moment, just trying to learn as much as I can about it, and like how good would it be to just hang out here all day?

Owen 33:46

That's pretty great. I mean, today's my day off, and I've been here all day, so I d I totally get it. Um yeah, unreal. It's in I think it's really interesting because I'm I'm at I'm and have been for, I don't know, a couple of years now. I feel like I've been in almost the exact opposite state where I'm doing music every day, which is a blessing, and I absolutely love that. But I've been experimenting and trying to find what my like find new hobbies and what my other things are to like unwind and and re-relax and like take my mind off work because I'm I'm really fortunate that w music has become work and it's not not like it was when I was a kid or when I was even a teenager and you know, playing music and listening to music was a way of unwinding. Listening to music definitely still is a way of unwinding, but um yeah, I've just I've gone actively and gone and sought other things like I had uh during COVID, I started skateboarding since stopped doing that. It only took six stenches in in my chin and and you know falling over a bunch of other more times after that. Um started golfing now, which is like my old man thing that I've been doing. Um but that's been my way of unwinding. Mixed netball on a Monday night. Nice. I played a bit of mixed netball. Yeah, in my day, yes. I've played a bit of mixed netball in my day. Indoor, yeah. You yet to yet to find out. It's super fun. Yeah, it's fucking hard too. It's ridiculous. I'm like, I'm easily like the widest and tallest bloke on the fucking court. So I'm a klutz. I'm like, I'm I've caught I've dubbed myself, I've played two games now. Um and my my girlfriend, it's with her netball team. So bulk of it is her netball team. My uncle plays as well. Um, this uh other bloke plays, um, and then the rest is is my girlfriend's netball team. So uh I've dubbed myself the contact king because I just get pulled for fouls almost every minute. Um, but it's good fun, it's great fun. Um yeah, it's uh it's ridiculous. But it's it's a great way to like, yeah. I leave the studio at like you know four, five, six o'clock, go down, play mixed net ball, sweat it out. Um, and it's a great way of unwinding. I've also found I it's funny being on a podcast and talking about podcasts, but podcasts are fucking great to because sometimes I'll leave the studio after mixing for you know six hours or whatever, or being in a session for from fucking eight till ten, or you know, hearing music all day, the last thing I want to do is get in my car and hit play on literally any song ever. So podcasts are so great to just like disconnect after a day of work, or good old ABC 702 is also a dream for doing that. Listening to people waffle on talkback radio is the best.

Jimmy 36:56

It's I've always loved listening to people waffle. I think this is why um starting a podcast is actually perfect for me as well. Nice, it's yeah, it's it's crazy how just listening to people talk can be cathartic, you know, it's therapeutic. 100%. Yeah, yeah, definitely. Um what podcasts do you listen to?

Owen 37:17

Um I like the Hello Sport podcast. That one's great. Um, and that's good because it's I I love I love sport. Like I uh you know, like I said, play golf, playing netball. I've played uh football, soccer since I was a kid and still play. Um love watching footy and rugby and whatever sport is on big bash, cricket, whatever. So yeah, that's a great podcast. There's like two episodes a week, and it's just two blokes spinning yarns about what's happened in the week of sport. So yeah, it's great, it's really good. Um, yeah, I love that. And then if I'm feeling um, if I'm feeling like I need to do some professional development, I like um there's a podcast called Working Class Audio that I really like, and that's good. They he this guy um of uh Matthew Bourdreau, that's his name. He's the host of the podcast, and he talks to like audio engineers and producers about um yeah, how they go about their creative process, but then also gets into like you know more nitty-gritty stuff about how they cut their teeth and you know how they have that like work-life balance, which I think is great too. Um Tape Notes is another good music one that I listen to if I'm feeling that kind of way. Um yeah, those are sort of the main ones. And then I also yeah, that's it really. And the old 7am podcast, that's good for a bit of news. 7am podcast.

Jimmy 38:40

I you know, I um it was probably a couple of years before COVID, but I stopped reading the news. I used to read the newspaper all the time, and I'm like I'd read the sports section, then flick through the other stuff, and you're like, oh bullshit, bullshit. And I just like I just stopped reading the news, I stopped watching the news, and then it was actually funny, like somebody started talking about recent, like you know, it was about a year ago about Donald Trump running for office, and I'm like, didn't he already do that? They're like, he's doing it again. I'm like, no, not in like I didn't even know that was happening again. I'm like, fuck. So I kind of stay out of the loop with a lot of stuff, and I'd I really only find out about it because other people are talking about it. And then sometimes I might get a little bit interested and you know, kind of look some stuff up, and then I'm just like, oh, what are you doing reading this bullshit? It's so depressing. Yeah, I was gonna say, do you find it bogs you down? Well, no, well, nothing really bogs me down. I'm quite a positive person that just gets on with shit mostly, but um I find I don't know, I've I'm I feel like it's all just propaganda. I feel like it's all just one-sided, like you're you like it's not real. Do you know? Yeah, sure.

Owen 39:51

It's just like one person's perspective on what's happening all the time.

Jimmy 39:55

Even even with sports with athletes, right? Like, how many times do you hear so-and-so is going to this club or that club? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then like two days later, the the athletes like, I don't know what you're talking about. I mean, like, was it a show news week? Like, so I I just think you've got to take everything that's you know, kind of there with a grain of salt. And like, even if you know, don't don't bank on any of that bullshit that you read in the paper, as far as I'm concerned, or see on the news. Like, I don't like you know, one day Iran and and Israel are about to blow each other up, and you know, I'd you know, I'd actually ask them really nicely on Facebook if they could wait another night because it was origin. Um, I don't know if they heard me or it was never gonna happen, right? Like yeah, but it's just all that shit's going on, and and realistically, uh as as no matter what my opinion of it is, I it's not gonna change it. So I try not to dwell on any of that stuff, you know. I I it's little, you know, live in the moment, like do what's in front of you. Um the the past is past, you're not gonna change that. You can say all these different things, it doesn't, you know, say it however you want. But I suppose my my philosophy on it is just to like, are you happy? And if you're not change that because if you're happy, right? Everything around you tends to be better, yeah. But if you're not happy, then everything around you tends to be shit, and that's something I've learned like in my life. So, like when I rock up somewhere, if if the mood looks down, I'd try to improve it, and if the mood's up there, I'd join it. Like I fuck yeah.

Owen 41:35

Do you I I just had visions of you rocking up to a job site and just everything's fucked, James, it's all fucking like it's all over the joint, and you just like skipping in.

Jimmy 41:46

I skip in and then say the most inappropriate stuff, yeah. And then it takes normally takes people about a week to understand that I'm just having a bit of fun, nothing serious. Um I had to we've got a I've got a new little apprentice at work, the Rizzler. He's a legend. And um Does he look like the Rizzler? No, no, no, no, no, no, it's a long story, but his name's his name's Riley, he's a great little kid. Um but he's alright, Rizzler. This is how you got your nickname, mate. So he's thin and he's really white, like a Rizzler paper.

Owen 42:26

Oh right, okay. He's the Rizzler. That's the way my brain works.

Jimmy 42:30

My brain works in kind of and you've you the nickname's just gotta come. I'm like it's so he was Riley for a few days and then it just snapped on my the Rizzler, and it it's great he's because he's accepted the nickname with open arms, great, um, and so was everyone else at work. Yep. So uh one of the bosses actually said the other day, he goes, I forgot his name was Riley. I was talking about the Rizzler at one of the meetings. Like, who's the Rizzler? He goes, Oh, Riley. And that's that's I think that's that's so fantastic when I one of my best mates and um band members, um Bert, his name's Bert, everyone calls him Bert. Yeah, I knew him for six years before I found out his name was Brett, yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's the best kind of name, and I know it's not that much different, but like I was somebody's like Brett, and I'm like, who's Brett? They're like, he's in your band. I might they're like, no, that's Brett. I might, and my head's and so they're the best nicknames when when you own it and they're yours. Yeah. Um, so I forgot where I was going with this story. What were we talking about before?

Owen 43:33

I was talking about you changing attitudes on the job site and the RISLA.

Jimmy 43:37

And we're talking about me changing. Yeah, so I look, I said to him the other day, because I'm I started my apprenticeship at 15 years old in it was 1998 and the guys I was working with were in their fifties, right? So I got brought up in the old school construction industry where lots of things were said. Yeah, that would probably get people thrown in jail these days, to be quite honest with you. Um, and I've toned myself right back, but at the same time as well, like I expect things to be done to a certain standard, and if I've taught you two or three times and they're not that standard, you get yelled at until you're at that standard. Fair enough. You know, like there's six guys at work, and I don't yell at any of them, but I yell at the Rizzler all day, right? But I did say to him today that yesterday I fucked up my cup myself, and I actually went, fuck an idiot, and I started yelling at myself. Like, and one of the other boys goes, Well, at least you're fair. Like, you 100%, you don't discriminate, you're just gonna yell at everyone. And that's my my initial reaction is to go, you should know better. Oh, I'm sorry, don't be sorry, be better, do it right, do it again. Yeah, but a minute later, I don't really care about that. Like it doesn't yeah, for sure. That's done, and we've spoken about it, we move on, and now everyone's good until the next time we fuck up, and then I'll the poor kid. Yeah, he actually made it till 2 30 yesterday. Huge 2 30. And I even I said to him, Don't make me come down that ladder. And I came down the ladder and was riding from asking for a screw. He goes, You can't find it, and I go, It's right there, I can see it, and I ended up coming down, I picked it up, and I went, You nearly made it all day, Risla. So even the yelling was fun, right? Like, eh, no, no, he's a good kid, and uh it's you know, it's my job as a tradesman to make sure that you know these kids that come through become you know, these apprentices that come through become tradesmen. So if they're doing something wrong, I take that personally. Like it's my job to bring them up to standard and to get them to where we want to be. Like, I'm not you know, we're we're not just tradies, we're teachers, you know, we're mentors, like you know, we I give terrible advice, but we give advice. Sure. Um, don't listen to anything I say is like it's all bad. Um but it's life lessons, you know, like we you know where you spend more more time with people at work than you do with your family members once you get into the real world. So like if you're going to work and you're having a bad time, you know, you you gotta you gotta change that somehow. So for for me, it's you know, I'd I try to do just as much, if not more, than the other boys to say, you know, like this is what we can get done, you know. I can push myself sometimes to um to show them what you know what we what we should be achieving, yeah. But also so that you can take a little step back as well and just be like, look, that's what we can do, but that's that was pretty crazy day. You know what I mean? Like we don't have to do that every day, but we got that done. Yeah, nice. And uh get in the you know, you get in the trenches with them and get dirty, like I don't like sitting there on the sideline and thus your fingers like I'm always in there, but you know what, nearly 30 years of experience um uh in all different uh parts of the industry, you know, you've got some knowledge to pass on as well to to these kids or new guys in the trade, and I love doing that. It's really you know, I love learning off them and I love teaching them.

Owen 47:15

Yeah, nice. So I guess I guess then the podcast is kind of an extension of that, right? It's kind of like extending your you know, your passion for learning in in your in your musical sense, no?

Jimmy 47:28

100%, that's exactly what it is, yeah. Um and you know, look, I'm just lucky enough that I've been the sparky up here and got a relationship with Scott where like to be on a side, like I'd I wanted to ask him if he'd be on a podcast with me for months and months and months, but I'm like, oh, and then we're up here working, I'm like, fuck it. I'm just gonna ask him, I'm like, yeah, hey Scott, if I start a music podcast, will you be on it? And then within 10 minutes, he's like, Well, we should be doing it up here, shouldn't we? And I'm like, Well, probably, like is that while we were like waist deep in a trench, like trying to fix the power for studio two to get it back up and running. Um, I take those challenges personally as well, like trying to get stuff done. I've taken on a full-time job where I'm not working for myself anymore. And Scott rang me, I'm like, man, we're all we can do is dig here and dig there. He's like, Well, we'll dig, you get up here, and you know, it wasn't just me, like you guys helped fix that power.

Owen 48:22

Dig we fucking did, yeah.

Jimmy 48:26

Yeah, it was actually funny. I have to um the boys were were digging all day, and um what you six hours or something, you dug that trench for to open it up for me, and we thought we'd cleared the problem. Uh the conduit was all blocked up, and long story short, we thought we'd fix the problem, and then all of a sudden we found that we hadn't fixed the problem.

Owen 48:46

There was another problem about 10 metres further up, and I'm like, we've got to dig another hole, and I saw the looks on their faces, they're like, Yeah, well, we're all soft-handed music producers who have been fucking digging holes and I grabbed.

Jimmy 49:00

Yeah, I won't looked at me after about 30 minutes of digging, he goes, You've done that before, haven't you?

Owen 49:06

Fucking oh, yeah. Oh nice. Um, you mentioned before Zooms with your mate during COVID. Yeah, what what was the biggest thing that you learned, or what was the biggest takeaway that you took from from those zooms?

Jimmy 49:24

Alright, I've actually thought about this, and for me, honestly, as a guitarist, it was to stop looking at music as letters and start looking at as numbers. Oh, yeah, nice. Yeah, um, and for me that opened up the guitar neck for me. Obviously, having a guitar neck with frets that are a semitone apart, you you know, once you learn one scale, you kind of know every scale, and it's it's hard to comprehend that without knowing any music theory at all. But once you know the positions of those notes of whether it's the minor pentatonic scale, well, now you know the relative major pentatonic scale as well, and it's just a matter of finding those root notes and hanging around on them. So I think for me that was probably the biggest thing, and from that um now when I play a song rather than just trying to find A key and playing in A key, I've realized that every time I change a chord I can play notes that are in the key of that chord. So if we're playing a G major chord, I can play any note in the G major scale at that time. But if we move to a D minor, I don't have to stay in G, I can play any note in the scale. Get into your modes work. So I think for me that opened up a lot more colour and like sonically my guitaring improved. Nice. Like when I say overnight, like within a week, do you know what I mean? Like I was like, hey, well, I know that, now I know this, well now I know that as oh, there's a pattern, holy shit, and it was like a you know, an aha moment, like it went boom, like lights turned on, and then for me, for me, my my playing got better so quickly that I thought I have to learn more because it'll only get better now. Like, and I think that's you know, that's where my even though I've been playing forever, my my thirst for music knowledge really only comes about in the last five years. Like before that I was happy to just I can learn that song and look at a tab or look at a chord chart or go on YouTube and within you know within five minutes I could play the bones of the song and within a week I'd have melodies down and solos and all that kind of shit. But I was playing by memorising things, not but now I don't need to know don't need to memorize anything, I can just kind of figure it out. And you'd know yourself, like you know, I've never played that song before, and I you know, by the end of the song, you're like, oh, it's gonna go there, like yeah, yeah, for sure. You know, and for some people who are listening to this you that might make no sense, and you know, for a lot of people that have been playing their whole life, they'll know exactly what I mean by that. Like it just makes sense for that to be the next call, yeah.

Owen 52:14

It's like predicting the ending of a book or a movie or something, like, oh yeah, of course I've got to resolve it, right?

Jimmy 52:19

Like in you know, without that, without that resolution, like that you don't have anything to begin with. Yeah, yeah. So I suppose um, you know, understanding that was what is my biggest takeaway.

Owen 52:31

Nice, yeah. I um I actually had a similar experience recently when I had to learn all these country songs. Um the artist she went over to Nashville and had all of her music produced there. Um, so it came back sounding great. And the charts that we got were the same charts that the band used on the day of recording, so they were all in Nashville number system. Yep. Um, and I my it took like a hundred percent of my brain capacity the first time I played the charts to like I was literally playing four chords, but I was looking at like one, four, and I was like, fucking like it was like learning to walk again for a second. I was like, oh my god, but I got there. Um but yeah, it's it's super handy, and it's obviously super quick because like you know, I was looking at chicken scratchings of like however many songs it was, and you know, the band have blasted through it in a day, and then I eventually got my pea brain around it as well. So it's yeah, it's a it's a fucking sick way of thinking about music.

Jimmy 53:33

Well, it's it's uh I was at a friend's wedding a couple of years ago and there was a uh um they had a blues guitarist there just you know playing at the reception, and um he had an old um ovation guitar there.

Owen 53:50

Oh nice, yeah. And I was like, oh are they the ones with the funny sound holes?

Jimmy 53:53

They're like they've got they're all different. Like they were, I think they were like Sears catalogue guitars from America, like the ovation, and they're like, That looks like an ovation. Like so had like a rounded back on it, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and anyway, I was like, Oh, nice ovation. And he was like, Well, you must play because you wouldn't know what an ovation is. Yeah, he goes, jump up, and I'm like, oh, and he goes, Come on, it's easy. It's one, four, five, hang around on the six, and then come back on the one again. And I was like, fuck me, dead. All right, yeah. And then we started playing. I was like, I'm like, what's the six? What's the six? So I just watched him play the first time, and I was like, Alright, I'm good to go. Let's like let's hit it. Um, like the E minor pentatonic scale is probably my favourite to play. He goes, What can you play? And I'm like, E minor. And he did it, and we jammed along. We played for I don't know, like 10, 12, 15 minutes. He played a couple of songs, sang, like, and I was just jamming along on top and had a bit of fun going both ways, and said thanks a lot. And so, you know, before before that, I would I wouldn't have been able to go up on stage with him and and do that. Like it wouldn't have made any sense at all. But for me, the numbers, like I'm a numbers guy anyway, right? So when when he explained to me, like, you know, the first is always the root, you know, and when you play the blues, we play the one, four, five, one's always here, four's always there, it's five always there. If you're in major scale, you know, your four and five always gonna be major, if you're in minor, your four and five always gonna be my like learning those things, then that opens up like this other stuff. So really you've only got to try to remember where you like your two and three are, yeah, you know, and your six and seven, because yeah, the four one, four, five, that's my go-to with the blues. So I can find one, four, five anywhere on the guitar now, and just these other chords, you know, they just add that little bit of colour or or turn it from a blues song into a pop song, or uh like for me, like adding you know, adding one of those other chords changes the whole feel for me now from a blues song to maybe a punk song, or depending on the way you strum, you know, there's all those different things you can do with it. So for me, that's just the basis. Like you learn that and everything else comes comes off it.

Owen 56:08

So is that have you has that opened you like have you been songwriting as well?

Jimmy 56:15

I was speaking to Tori about this the other day. I'm I'm a terrible songwriter. Um per like I think I am anyway. Um I what I love collaborating with people, like I love like you know maybe adding something like sitting down with somebody like I've got this but I don't really know where to go and like building on something with someone. I'd I find the idea of like laying my heart out on paper to be I don't know, it's not me. Um I'd talk about it and I can do all that shit, but I'd I haven't found a way to translate that onto my guitar yet. I I've written some nice riffs and you know I've got some little bits and pieces here and there, but like nothing that would constitute an album or a record or um or anything like that. But in a collaborative sense, I'd I really I really enjoy I really enjoy building songs with other people um but not so much writing I'd I don't know how to explain that properly, but yeah, not so much writing them, more just building building them.

Owen 57:23

Sure, so you like building the building the chords and the instrumentation as opposed to building say the melody and the lyrics? I love I love finding the melody for a song.

Jimmy 57:34

Like if somebody's got chords, I'd love finding a melody to go along with those chords. But lyrics, I'm like honestly, my lyrics are so shit. It's like I'm patting a cat while I'm wearing a hat. I think I'll be fat. Like, yeah, didn't know you're out, that's fun. It's just I find them to be like when I've tried to write lyrics, I just find them cringe worthy. I don't think that I would want to sing in front of someone. So, but um like yeah, musically I've got you know a couple of things there that you could consider songs um that I like, but that's more to if I find somebody to jam with, I'll sure you know, and I'm so open I love that collaboration process. Like I'm so open to everybody's ideas, like you know, four brains are better than one. I'll listen to everything, throw out all the shit and take out the two or three pieces that I like out of it and hang on to that all the time. Um but yeah, building building something from scratch, I'd uh it's not out of the picture. Um I say it um's too much, sorry. It's not out of the picture and definitely if I found the right people I'd be open to uh recording an album, but I don't think I have anything worthy to give the world personally.

Owen 58:56

Yeah, right. Interesting. Interesting. It sounds like maybe you haven't found the right people, potentially. Because if I I feel like there's definitely people that are that are the exact opposite of you, like there's plenty of people out there that are just like, oh, I have all these lyrics and I don't have any music for them. Um so maybe you need to find one of those people. Quite possible.

Jimmy 59:18

Oh look, I'm definitely open to that. Yeah. Uh he you we spoke with Tori about tapping into the ether. You know, I just for sure. I I haven't tapped into the ether yet. Yeah, I know that. Like I wish I had.

Owen 59:31

Yeah, I f I find the the tapping into the ether thing for me I feel like I'd do it better or kind of there's two ways. A, I feel like songwriting's like any other kind of skill or any other thing whereas like if I'm doing it more often, I'm feeling better about it or I'm doing it better. But then I also feel most comfortable about it when I when I like forget that I'm doing it, or I've like I love I love sitting down with like you know, a shit drum loop or like a little drum machine vibe in my computer, my guitar, a vocal mic right up on my face, and I'm just like mumbling and playing at the same time, and then you know, I've I literally will just like record for an hour or however long, and eventually that last three minutes of the whole hour will be the song or will be the be the idea, is kind of the way that I approach it, and that for me it becomes like I don't know, uh it I becomes kind of subconscious in a way, or it starts subconsciously and then becomes more conscious, if you know what I mean. Like I just start by fucking around and mumbling, and then I'll forget the bit that I was mumbling before and start mumbling something new and or change the chords that I'm playing, or um and then after that, uh if I'm properly fleshing out a demo, then I'll come back around and I'll like put on my producer hat, or I'll put on like a different hat and then come back around and start thinking about yeah, cut start thinking about like you know, oh this probably doesn't need a three-minute verse going into a 15-minute guitar solo. But um but yeah, that's um that's sort of how I tap into that.

Jimmy 1:01:30

I think the best things I've ever written I've never recorded because it's just been there plane for four hours, and I'm like, fuck, that's sick. And then I'm like well, I haven't even got my phone. Like I just and then the next day you're like, Oh, was I playing yesterday? And you're like, no, it's just not gone. Um so you know, having you know, having this stuff around, I suppose, to and I know you're doing at home as well with your own gear, but yeah, you know, like having that all that recording gear around just to be able to record yourself when you are doing it, yeah, um, I suppose would would might help.

Owen 1:02:02

Yeah, I think I think I also I personally like I like rhythm when I start, like I like having a little drum loop, but the humble iPhone is also like an absolute weapon of um, you know, um just voice memo demos. And I also like I really like getting those, like especially if I'm working with an artist for the first time, if they come in and Tom and I hear like, so what have you been working on? Blah blah blah, anything you want to start from scratch, and they're like, Oh, I've got a voice memo, and that's like fucking perfect. If they've got a voice memo that we can then continue to write and build upon and put together a proper demo, then that's always a great place to start, especially with someone that you like you've just met, it's a songwriting session. How's the drive up? Oh yeah, the studio's in a weird spot. Yeah, ha ha ha. Like it's that that first half an hour, yeah. Like a voice memo is the ultimate icebreaker, really, in those settings. It's so good. Oh, cool. And now I'm gonna sit here with the easy. What um what's uh what's the first what's the first cassette or the first CD you ever you ever bought?

Jimmy 1:03:17

So the first one I ever purchased with my own money was Metallica and Justice for All. I got to listen to that up at my cousin's house at Foster over one Christmas and and decided that that was what I was gonna spend my money on.

Owen 1:03:32

Over one Christmas is crazy. Was there not? Can we put on some Carols, boys? Can we well?

Jimmy 1:03:38

So I look, we listened to a lot of stuff over that. So my my cousin David is actually he's kind of one of my music mentors, actually, to be honest with you. Um yeah, growing up, he played the piano at church, and always thought that we're just letting him do it because his family were there because we only ever went to church when it was like a Christmas or a wedding or Christian or something like that, right? So we'd go up there and and we'd go in, he'd always play the piano. And I'm remembering one day saying to my parents, I'm like, that's nice of them to let him do it when his family's here. And my mum's like, No, he's really good, he does it all the time. But then he went from um playing the piano to playing guitar, and that would have been around the time of this purchase, my first album purchase. And remember just like watching him play guitar, just going, Oh, I've got to learn how to do that.

Owen 1:04:26

So I that might have even been was he the same one that taught you guitar that taught me.

Jimmy 1:04:31

No, no, not at all. No, um, he actually didn't teach me anything either. I just used to watch him and go, That's so fucking cool. I want to do that. Yeah, right. Um, and then he became a drummer, and David's still a drummer to this day. He's been a music teacher, he plays in different bands. Um, he quite often puts his his band's music in music league uh playlists for us. Self shameless plug. Shameless plug, yeah. Uh but yeah, yet again, he's a a seasoned pro. Like, you know, he can go from metal to rockabilly with his skills, right? Because that's what he does. Like it's not he's not into one kind of music, he's into music, which is something I've always um kind of looked up to. Um, but yeah, we we spent a lot of time. I think he might have been learning some of the songs on guitar or something like that. So spent a lot of time listening to that album over that Christmas, and um that was ended up being my first my first personal purchase because of that. Had a few um tapes and CDs that I listened to a lot before that, but they obviously weren't my own personal purchase, they were just kind of family family records. What about yourself? What was your first album purchase?

Owen 1:05:41

Um the one that I remember buying with my old man was uh Kings of Leon because of the times. He he bought it from Sanity at Tugra. I didn't buy it myself because I was fucking nine when that record came out. But um They're making me still old. Came out 2008, I think. Is that right? Probably. Um But yeah, I mean the uh I was an I was an iPod kid, so I don't uh but the first thing when I went and got a record player, I went and bought Wheeze's blue album because that was yeah, which is just a classic teenage boy record to buy, I think. Um but yeah, I mean I I've always I think the physical physical owning of music is something that's so cool because it it just adds to your experience as a as a fan and as a as a as a punter. Like I especially that Kings of Leone album. I know my dad then went and saw them at the Newcastle Entertainment Centre and the ticket goes into the C D sleeve and then you know continues to kick about the car and um it's great. It's such it's such a cool way. It's the best way to consume music and sit there and read the liner notes and immerse yourself in in listening to it as opposed to just like hitting play on it.

Jimmy 1:07:00

Well I made Solder Brothers had a wall of tickets from all the concerts you've been to. That's sick. So cool. Just to look at it and just like, oh, you've seen them, you've seen them, you've seen them. That's mad. Yeah, it was pretty it was a pretty awesome bit of artwork actually, really.

Owen 1:07:14

Yeah, that's d yeah, how dangerous.

Jimmy 1:07:17

The old ticket tickets, they rip off 100% stuff and you bring it home and stick it up on the wall. Yeah, I remember um one year we went to a gig and they like took your whole ticket and I'm like, hey, what are you doing? Like that's proof that you went. They're like, oh no, people are handing them out and trying to get past that and doing all this kind of stuff, so you can pick one up on your way out. And that was kind of the the end of the the ticket, you know, like the ticket no longer exists, does it really?

Owen 1:07:43

Yeah, no, and they're all on your fucking iPhone. You're on your phone, yeah, 100%. Like, and then if you get them if you get if you don't get the iPhone version, you just get a shit bit of paper that you print out. Like you don't get a fucking ticket ticket, which sucks.

Jimmy 1:07:59

Kid at work the other day, a guy at work the other day was telling me about um the Tomorrowland tickets. When his mate got some tickets to Tomorrowland.

Owen 1:08:05

Did it go this year?

Jimmy 1:08:06

Yeah, and it was like a it came as a box, and you like open it up and then a drawer pops out, and there's a key in there, and you take the key out and you open up another section and then your ticket pops out of like that's fucking ridiculous.

Owen 1:08:20

That's fucking great.

Jimmy 1:08:21

Yeah, expensive tickets, so you might as well get something to keep, I can't say. But it's you know, that's kind of cool that they've um, you know, kind of kept that alive.

Owen 1:08:29

Did you see the the stage burnt down? Did you see that? No, I did not. Bro, it was fucking check it out. So you know Tomorrowland famous for having insane sets, yeah. Insane sets They've built it for like a year, don't they? Something like that. Something ridiculous. But the fucking day, I think like no, maybe it was like three days before the show or the opening day of the festival, the whole fucking thing burned down. Yeah. And it fucking but what they uh kudos to them, they managed to still have that main stage as a place, and it it's it's not the big set that you would expect, it's just like a big LED kind of screen and then a DJ booth in the middle. Yeah, but you can see behind the LED screen the the ruins of the stage. Yeah, it's fucking crazy. Yeah, that is crazy. No, I had no idea about that. Yeah, you've got to see the photos, it's fucking insane. But it's I reckon it's so impressive that they were still able to put a show on. Put the show, yeah. The show must go on, right? Absolutely, yeah.

Jimmy 1:09:27

It's insane. In the truest sense of the sentence there.

Owen 1:09:31

Yeah, speaking of show, what was the first show you went to?

Jimmy 1:09:34

My first gig that I was taken to with my parents was um my parents took me to see Elton John when I was pretty young. I would have been, I don't know, maybe like five, six, something like that. Um my second was lucky enough to see In Excess with um Michael Hutchins singing. Mad. And the first gig that I went to without parents was I know serious, I'd finished year six going into year seven, and family friend who actually taught me how to play guitar, Vittor. Um family from Melissa, her boyfriend Vittor, they took me to um Pearl Jam at Eastern Creek the Vitology Tour. That's so cool. Fucking 12 years old. Everyone's like, what are you doing here, dude? I'm like, whatever I want, free range kid, man. That's mad. Front and center, like it was just you know, it was a dream. Like it was that's so cool, it was pretty cool.

Owen 1:10:29

Yeah, that's mad. As at the at the at the racetrack at the end of the day, it was at Easton Creek, yeah.

Jimmy 1:10:33

That's Eastern Creek racetrack. Sick. That's pretty cool. The lineup outside, it was like one of those 40 degree days, you know, like Bacon Hive. Every second day in Easton Creek. Oh mate, it was but like it was an absolute, absolute memory. Like, you know, something called Never Forget seeing that, that was pretty, pretty cool.

Owen 1:10:50

Yeah, that's sick.

Jimmy 1:10:51

What about yourself? What's your first gig?

Owen 1:10:53

Uh first one with parental guidance was I was insanely young. It was 2004. I would have been just about to turn for five years old then. Um so I went to big day out with my parents, which was so sick. And I remember um yeah, getting my hair spray painted bright red, going in with my earplugs, everyone looking at me like, what the fuck is this literal child doing here? Which is completely fair. Um, I remember yeah, watching the black-eyed peas with my auntie and uncle, and I remember being on my dad's shoulders in the boiler room watching Sonic animation, and then I got picked up at six o'clock by my godfather, and my parents kicked on into the night. Um, so um, and then after that, a couple of years after that, is when they brought in the age restrictions to so they made it all because of big day out. Maybe no. No, I was I was like the fucking I was apparent apparently the yarn is that I was on like the triple J website for ages and I was like the little big day out poster child for a while, which I mean I was a fucking cute kid, so I don't blame them. Um all downhill from 2004. Big early, absolutely way too early. Um and then yeah, so I I mean that was the first show that I ever w saw and and I remember seeing. I also won probably a sympathy win slash mum and dad paid for it, but uh saber tooth tiger that I took home with me from like the carnival games at Big Day Up was classic. Um and then the first show I went to after that. Or I mean to be honest, I'd um shows that I I've been to m most of most concerts that I have gone to I've gone to with my dad because my dad is has always been a big I guess he's a fucking mad music nerd, like he loves music so much, and he had me when he was like 18, so his dad's how old am I? Dad was born in like 1979. Um he's younger than Scott, which I like to remind Scott of every so often just to wig him out. Um so yeah, dad and I go to concerts all to get all the time together. The I think the next one I kind of remember going to after that is I would have been in year six and we went and saw Muse at um what is now Kudos, but I think at the time was called Old Phones Arena. And it was for their it was an Uprising album, I think.

Jimmy 1:13:34

Is that the one where they came up? Yes. I was there, yeah.

Owen 1:13:38

We're meant to do we're meant to do shows together. It's crazy. Yeah, they had three big uh plints that they were on. Yeah, um, yeah, that was fucking sick. Yeah, that was unreal. Yeah, and now Muse have become like my guilty pleasure band. I don't know why. But yeah, they're fucking great, but I feel every time I listen to them now. I don't know why. I don't know, and I don't feel that way about like I'll openly say that I fucking listen to Taylor Swift and Sabrina Carpenter and I fucking love it, and it's fantastic. And I don't feel that way about any other music except for Muse for some reason. I don't know why.

Jimmy 1:14:12

No, I think Muse is an amazing band. Um Matt Bellamy, he's uh the songwriter, singer songwriter for for Muse, but his bass plays bass and keys. Does he not he's uh um I could be wrong there.

Owen 1:14:22

He definitely plays keys, they got a bass player though. They got a bass player, yeah. They got a there's a bass drum.

Jimmy 1:14:27

I've seen them I've seen them a few times actually. I've seen the front and center of big day out, and I think that's when I was like, whoa man, these guys because you know they've got that sound when you listen to them you know on the CD, it's it's rock, it's dance, it's you don't know what it is, but that live performance they put on is takes it to a whole nother level, like yeah, you know.

Owen 1:14:48

I saw them a I've seen them twice. I saw them when they that first time, and then I saw them again on maybe the album after that. The one that is I think it's called The Second Lore, and it's like got more of those dance electronic elements that are that uh have become that were super prevalent on that album. And I remember they had like MIDI guitars. Have you seen this? They had like guitars that were essentially like guitar hero guitars on steroids. Okay. Like they had like yeah, buttons instead of strings and like a touch pad in I'll send it to you. It was actually I think I'm saying about that.

Jimmy 1:15:27

Yeah, yeah, no.

Owen 1:15:28

Yeah, I'm not all over it, but yeah, no, I think I might have seen a little reel on that or something called that. Yeah, it's so it's fucking crazy. But that show was sick too, because it was a mix of like, yeah, playing you know, rock music with Travis Bean guitars and then playing electronic music with like MIDI controllers, like good looking katars, not shit catars. It's great. What was the last gig you went to? Um good question. Um went to I don't know, they're all kind of it all feels like a blur. It was definitely nothing crazy. I think it was I think it might have been like the Lincoln Pin or something like that. I went and saw just like locals um doing their thing. Um, where was the last like kind of big band you went and saw? Uh last big band I would have seen probably Faye Webster. I saw her at the Metro last year, and she was great. She was really good, had this super duper tight band with her, and they just got up there, played their tunes, and just ripped slide guitar, lap steel, fucking super tight drummer. It was really good.

Jimmy 1:16:45

Cool, great. What about you? Uh well, last year we went to was actually Bato Pub. Uh not Batto Pub, it was um Budgy Pub. Classic. Yeah, went and saw um band called Tyrants. Oh yeah, yeah, classic. Uh I forget the first band that was on, they were really cool as well. And then uh the band that finished up was uh the OIS.

Owen 1:17:04

Oh yeah, I've been seeing them, but I haven't seen them yet.

Jimmy 1:17:07

They were fun, yeah. Um I look, they were super fun, kind of a you know, like a sticky fingers vibe. Let's say um Party Boys, like they they brought the house down. So yeah, it was it was that was a really fun gig. Um International band, I went and saw Idols at the beginning of the year. Fuck yeah, how are they? So cool. They're even better live. One of those another just like such a high energy band, and they got some really crazy sounds, so to see that actually come together as a live performance was was pretty wicked.

Owen 1:17:37

Yeah, that's mad. Tyrants are fucking great as well. They're Dylan, their lead singer and guitarist. I fucking he's got a great voice. Oh, yeah, are they? Yeah, there you go. Fucking hell, yeah. Mental, I'm gonna go to go to that.

Jimmy 1:17:52

They're great. Anyway, um, but yeah, they were cool. Um so first band, last band we've seen, first album. Um instruments.

Owen 1:18:11

Okay, yep. What do you play? Guitar by trade. Yeah. But as I said before, I'm a I don't I don't deem myself as a good guitarist. But yeah, guitar by trade. The first guitar I got given to me that Christmas when I wanted Guitar Hero, but instead got a guitar was um it was like a it was a this it was a strat replica, it wasn't a real strat, and it was it was like that three-quarter scale jobby because I was like seven. Yeah, uh, and it was a weird colour, it was like it was like a blue burst, like a sunburst blue into a black. Cool. Yeah, and then the first guitar that I bought after that, um, which is when uh might have been like late primary school, early high school, is I bought a Epiphone Lespo custom, which was white with gold finishings. Of course, yeah. It was uh it was special, it was sick.

Jimmy 1:19:08

What about you? Uh my first guitar was like it was an acoustic guitar as black as called a Palmer. I don't just a black acoustic guitar. I played that for years and years, and then I played a uh Squire Strat for a number of years, and then I went and bought myself a nice little Gibson SG. Fuck yeah, such a beautiful guitar, except that fucking G string can fuck itself. The give the classic Gibson G string, yeah. Um, and now I spend most of my time playing my beautiful Veronica, which is a Martin DM15. So nice. Um I went in to buy a guitar and I had a like, you know, had a little bit of money there to buy a guitar. And I'm like, treat yourself, you've been playing for 25 years, let's get something nice. And I went in there and I was having a look. And to be honest, I wanted like a cold clerk or a maton, like I wanted an Australian guitar. Yeah, I had my heart set on walking out with a maton or maybe a cold clerk if I was lucky. Yeah, and I played a couple of them, and like I played other matens in cold class before, which drew me to them. And I just the shop I was in, I don't know, they you know, it was alright. It was a lot of money for something that just felt alright. And I was like, I was looking at this guitar, I was in a case, it was like in a glass case, and he goes, Oh, you had guitar money. And I I actually said to him, I don't have that much money. He goes, Go on, just play it. So anyhow, I'd just I'd it was one strum, and I'm like, fuck, I'm buying this guitar online. It's so sick. And like that was another thing for me that when I when I started playing that guitar, I felt and it you know, it might sound a bit silly, but I felt like I got better. Yeah, no. So I got tighter, or did the quality of the instrument like made me think that I was bad. Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. I don't know what it was, but you know, there was that, you know, that was another reason. I'm like, I've got to do this thing justice, I've got to learn how to play it properly.

Owen 1:21:17

Um is that your most recent guitar purchase? Yeah, yeah, that's fucking mad. Yeah, that's a great purchase. And I also think obviously you I imagine you probably would have spent more money than uh like a cold Clark or something, but on par. Yeah, on par. I mean, then you definitely got a better guitar then. Those fucking Tom's got a Cole Clark, he's got a Fat Lady 2 or a Fat Lady 3, which is no like the full dreadnought size. He's got the one with the cutout. Looks great, it's feels fine to play, but it is the brightest fucking acoustic guitar to record. Like every time we record it, it's just like I'm putting like old dusty ribbon mics on it just to get it to sound like a normal guitar, because it just it you put like a nice new bright Neumann U87 or on it or something, and it just rips your head off every time. Um so yeah, I mean the only how do you it would how do you find this is proper guitar nerd talk now, but how do you find it holds its tuning slash deals with the Australian climate? So that's a very good question.

Jimmy 1:22:24

I've had a neck reset, I had body bellying that I had to get fixed. So I've having a you know a guitar that's built in the desert and then bringing it to the coast of New South Wales is quite a challenge, and it was something that I didn't really understand about guitars when I bought it. Yeah, and for me, I like having my guitars not on display so people can see them, but on display so I play it. If you've got a guitar sitting there, like if you own a guitar, put in a case and stick it under your bed, how often you're gonna get it out to play it, but if it's there on a stand and the TV's right next to it, I'll pick up a guitar before I grab the remote control for the TV. Right. So I had it hanging up on the wall so I could admire it and play it as much as I could, and then one day I'm like, this action seems a bit weird. Yeah. And I'm looking and I'm like, what's what's going on here? And I took it to my luthier, and he's like, Oh, it needs a neck reset. And then he said, You can't hang it on the wall, you've got to put it in a case. Yeah, the humidity is killing this thing. Yeah. Uh, you know, like working in construction, we work with uh being electrician. I'm not you know, I'm not a carpenter, but you know, work with timber and timber gets seasoned before it goes. And I'm thinking, wouldn't it be seasoned? How is it? But just you know, it's it's thin, yeah, it's it's it soaks up that humidity. I ended up getting a big a big bulge in the belly that had to be taken out. I lost her for about four months while she you know, steamed up and squashed down and steamed up and squashed down and steamed up and squashed down, and yeah. Um but you know, the beauty of wood is you can work with it, right? Like it was cheaper to fix it than it was to buy another one. Yeah, thank fuck. Yeah, thank fuck. Yeah, uh but so that that has been a challenge. One thing I a friend of mine who um plays violin said to me, Why don't you put a mud in there? And I'm like, a what? A mud? And it's this, they're so cool. I'd had no idea about them, but apparently if you own a cello or a violin, you've known about them forever. But it's a little vial and it's a desiccant, right? And it's a glass vial that has this like mud from New Zealand that soaks up humidity.

Owen 1:24:38

Oh, like a little silica gel packet for your instrument.

Jimmy 1:24:41

Yeah, it's similar, but it's like it's like it's reusable, right? So I'll bring it in, I'll show you next time. Um, but it's got an MUD, they're mud. So MUDs um something desiccant musical, something we'll look it up. We'll look it up. Yeah, um, I'll put a link for you guys to all have a look at. But essentially you keep this little glass vial in your guitar case, it's in a little velvet bag, yeah, and it sucks it keeps your guitar case at uh perfect humidity, so it sucks the humidity out of the but not too much. Yeah, the the the idea is that the uh the product inside actually wants to keep it at a really nice humidity for you at a nice medium level. So this when you look at the mud to begin with, it's like terracotta red as it soaks in moisture, it goes in really black. Yeah, and you actually take it out, put it in the microwave for 30 seconds, dry it out, and then you it steams it all up and it dries all out. You might have to do that two or three times to get it back to that terracotta red, put it back in the velvet bag, put it in your case. I keep my guitar in the case, and ever since I've owned that, I haven't had any issues with nice humidity in my instrument, but I've cleaned that thing out, I've had to like drain the humidity out of that six times in two years. Yeah, right.

Owen 1:25:50

Nice. Well, I mean, fucking worth it.

Jimmy 1:25:52

Worth every cent. Absolutely. Yeah, I'd recommend anyone on the coast that doesn't have a humidified room for their expensive instruments.

Owen 1:25:59

I think that's the only benefit to like the Cole Clarks and I mean the maintenance. I think the maintenance sound great, to be honest. They sound a lot better than a Cole Clark, but those Aussie timbers are just kind of a bit more used to it, so they're just acclimatised to the temperature here, which is great. Yep. Um, but yeah, fuck yeah. I recently picked up a uh Gretsch Jim Dandy concert guitar, a little bit bigger than the Parlour guitar, and I fucking love it. It's just my at-home guitar that I have kicking around and play on the couch or play sitting in bed, and it's like tiny and little and awesome. The other cool thing that I really love about it is it has uh has a pickup in it, but it's not like it's not like a pickup that you'd have in other acoustic guitars. It's like it's not microphonic, it's like a single coil pickup that it runs across the sound hole. Yep. Um so plugging it into a DI, it sounds cool and like a bit distorted and stuff, but then plugging it into an amp, it sounds fucking sick. It's such a cool little it's like it's such a unique sound. It's fucking great and I love it.

Jimmy 1:27:06

I want to pile a guitar so bad.

Owen 1:27:08

Yeah, yeah.

Jimmy 1:27:09

Yeah, I love it. Um that's my music, the old blues stuff. I I love it. Yeah, I just I even like um picking up my daughter, she's got a little like three-quarter um classical guitar, yeah. And just picking up that and fucking around with that, some of the sound you get out of those little like it's a $120 Kmart jobby, you know, like it's sure. Sound that good, you know. I'm like, this thing's fucking wicked. That's correct.

Owen 1:27:38

So fucking good.

Jimmy 1:27:39

Uh yeah.

Owen 1:27:40

Nice. Do you play it just guitar, your main, your main? Do you play anything else?

Jimmy 1:27:45

Yeah, so everything else I muck around with. I wouldn't call myself proficient in anything else. Yeah. I can play a piano if it's in C or A minor, because I don't touch the black keys. No less. Yeah, for sure. But that's just me only cheating with my, you know. My new found um music knowledge lets me know that this is always gonna sound good, right? Like so I can well not always, but mostly gonna sound good. So I'm gonna remember that I play I've played the harmonica for a few years now. Sick. Yet again like I've never had a lesson, and if you played the harmonica, you'd probably think I can't, but I can make it sound pretty good. Yeah. Um I yet yet again, another instrument I'm nowhere near proficient in, but I've played the didroodoo since I was a little kid. Mad. Um I probably learnt how to you do the circular breathing? Yeah.

Owen 1:28:35

Yeah, nice.

Jimmy 1:28:35

I and it's that's a that's look, that's another one of those things that if you don't play for a while, it you know might take you a few minutes to kind of lock yourself back in, but once you get that rhythm going, you can you can hang in there for a while. I've learned when I was super young, so that was something that's just always kind of stayed with me. Nice. Um apart from that, you know, I've muck around on a trumpet. Cool. Yet again. It's just like, oh that sounds bad, that sounds good, I'll do that again. I don't really know what I'm doing. Fuck yeah, that's sick.

Owen 1:29:07

Do you have do you have a trumpet at home? I don't have a trumpet at home.

Jimmy 1:29:11

No. A friend did, and so I used to muck around with theirs. Um, but yeah, I'll give anything a crack. I don't mind. I had we had a drum kit sit at home for my son to play. Never really he when he got some lessons, how does he say get some lessons? The drum teacher's like, alright, so this is a basic drum pattern. Yeah, we're gonna hit the hi hat four times, and we're gonna hit the two of mine and do this. And he just sat down, he's like, and the drum teacher's like, How long's he been playing for? I go, about three and a half minutes. He's serious? I'm like, yeah. That's crazy. And so then just with his mentality, he kind of went, Oh, well, I know how to do that. And just was like, I'm done with that now. I'm done with that now. So, you know, we we did that for a little bit. So I used to go down and and muck around on muck around on the drums. Um obviously being in a band, there was, you know, there's always if you're in the garage, the drum kids there, so I'd always try to muck around. I'm a terrible drummer, but I do I do enjoy making noise on the drums as well.

Owen 1:30:13

Drums are the best. Drums are so much fucking fun. Anytime that I'm in a rehearsal room and the drummers are I'm just going to the bathroom, you best believe I'm gonna be sitting down in the next room.

Jimmy 1:30:22

I'm gonna put my nuts in your drums. Yeah, for honest to God.

Owen 1:30:25

Yeah, I'm so fucking literally, and I like I'm fucking god awful at the drums. I know I can fucking hold a rock beat and that's about it, but something about it is just so fun. It's the best, it's so good. I um yeah, my partner has we we hang out with Tom, who I've mentioned a couple of times, and his his girlfriend, she's a she's an uh an artist and a musician, her name's Shannara, fantastic singer and songwriter. So when we all hang out, my girlfriend Alex is the odd one out that doesn't do music or doesn't you know play an instrument or anything, so she took it upon herself to learn the harmonica. Oh cool. So she's been learning the harmonica, and uh she has two hilarious harmonica bits. One is playing Piano Man, which just fucking makes me laugh every single time.

Jimmy 1:31:22

A song called Piano Man, the guy with the harmonica short up and shut the fuck up, does he?

Owen 1:31:26

Absolutely. So fucking funny. Um and then the other hilarious thing with her being able to play the harmonica now is anytime it's a family member's birthday, we call them, and she plays happy birthday on the harmonica, and I sing, and it just it rips every time. It's so fucking funny, it's the best instrument.

Jimmy 1:31:47

It is. What I loved about it was um it was probably the first instrument that I kind of realized that you can hear it, you can hear it for it's wrong, you know? Yeah, yeah, 100%. And you know, with a guitar, you've got six strings and all these frets, and pianos has all these keys, and you know, saxophone has all these things, and like you know, it can seem daunting to think, well, how do I make any sound with that? Yeah, but with a harmonica, there's eight holes you blow. Breathing right, yeah. It's like like you, you know, um what does beautiful saying you're only ever a semi-tone away from the right note. So on a hunting harmonica, it's not hard to find it. Uh and sometimes even just by breathing it out and moving it, you go, well, that sounded alright. Um you know, you repetition patterns, that's what music is. So just have a go at it, have a crack.

Owen 1:32:42

Fuck yeah. Um something that you did in another episode that we've recorded that I really liked is you asked Scott what uh outside of music or outside of his job, what keeps him going and what are the things that keep him happy. What is that for you? What are the things that keep James happy and keep James moving and shaking?

Jimmy 1:33:10

I've got a lot of interests um just because my brain works that way. I I can't really just do one thing of it and do lots of things. So um for me uh spending time with my kids is pretty important. So my son plays uh rugby league and I like to be involved in that. What position does he play? He's a he's a front rower. Hell yeah. He's a big boy mad. Um and my daughter, my daughter plays netball during the winter, nice, but her jam is in summer nippers surf life. Sick. What club? Uh North of Oka, nice clubs. Oh yeah. Um so I like to go down and help out with water safety, you know, paddling on the on the rescue boards and nice. I try to get down to a few patrols every year. I don't make all of them, sorry, Brody. Um But you know, I try to help out, help out down there where I can. Um so there are things, fun things I like to do. But see, for me, um music isn't my professional. So I'm at work on the tools for eight to ten hours a day. Yeah. And when I get home, that's when I get to rip in. Rip in. Yeah. So you know, music is for me a way to a way to relax, rewind, rejuvenate. Um, it's therapy, it's it's it's ever it's it's everything to me. And yeah, it's probably I suppose I I said I did say before that I don't live with regrets, but I suppose I suppose one thing that I would would have liked to have done is maybe done a little bit more in music. Um I I suppose I I let my trade really guide where I went because I was good at that. You know, I'm alright at being a spiky, and there's some, you know, you can kind of earn a living off being an electrician. And I know some really fantastic musicians that don't make any money off music. And I always kind of thought, well, if they can't, how do I stand a chance? Because I, you know, I feel that they're more talented, more experienced, more deserving of the right to have that career. So I I probably you know didn't chase a dream in music because I didn't think I was good enough. Yeah, for sure. Right, and so I suppose that may end up being a regret, but I think one beautiful thing about this podcast is I get to have, you know, a path in the music industry, whether it's playing an instrument or not, being here and talking to you know the likes of yourself and Scott and Tori, like lifelong musicians and people that work in the industry, I now get to pursue a path in music that I feel comfortable with pursuing. For sure. Yeah. And I feel like now that we've recorded a few episodes, if we don't launch this and I don't at least give it a go, then this would be definitely a regret. Yeah, 100% that's a driving force to get some episodes down and get this on the air and get it in people's ears.

Owen 1:36:26

Like, yeah, well, I mean, if someone's listening to this, they now know there's no regrets. They now know that I've seen the light of day.

Jimmy 1:36:34

And look, nobody has to listen to it. I've still given it a crack. Like, and that's for me, that's you know, it's it's it's exciting. This is an exciting new chapter for me. Um, you know, I'd for like the podcast was a bit of an idea, and then I came up here and I spoke to, you know, and I'd you guys, and then all of a sudden I saw you guys, we're like, well, that sounds pretty cool. And then sat down and did that one with Scott, and then I spoke to you on Scott again, and I actually saw a bit of well, I felt like I saw a bit of excitement in you guys about the podcast, which would definitely like pump me up because I'm like, I just thought it was a cool idea, and now other people think it might be a good idea. Let's give it a crack. So, you know, we're just gonna do it. Um, we're gonna be, we've got our own ideas, but we're also gonna be driven by the people that listen to it. Um, all my favorite podcasts are massively community driven. They're they've got communities behind them, the people that listen to them have a say in what happens, and not so much like do this, do that, but oh, can you talk to this person? Oh, I want to hear about this, I want to learn about that. Nice, and so you know, going forward, we'll get some socials up so people can jump on board and come along for the ride because it's a journey, right? And I want people to join me on the journey. I want people to feel like they're sitting in the studio having this chat with us, not just you know, listening to it. Like, yeah, so that's you know, that's the idea behind it. That's where that's how I want to roll it. I I want to learn more. Hopefully, other people can learn something as well. Yeah, you know, if we get it wrong, you can let us know. Might throw the fuck off, but I might not. I'm happy to be told I'm wrong sometimes.

Owen 1:38:12

If they do it the right way, they have to do it the right way. Write in, handwritten letter, it's it. Fuck yeah, amazing.

Jimmy 1:38:20

Yeah.

Owen 1:38:21

Cool. I reckon we've got some stuff. Yeah, alright.

Jimmy 1:38:27

Alright, so how we finish every podcast is with a song recommendation. Have you got a song recommendation for us today on?

Owen 1:38:34

Yeah, I have been rinsing at the moment, and I don't, and it's been like it's it's been stuck in my head. I've been playing it on guitar, I've been listening to it like once a day. Um, it's exit music for a film by Radiohead off okay computer. And I've just I don't know w what it is about it, it's just been an earworm for me for the last like week. And it's like, it's fucking sad. It's a fucking sad song. Um, but it's I don't I don't know. I love the way that like this sad story is conveyed like quickly and succinct, and then there's this beautiful, massive crescendo, and then it drops into this just a strip back outro, and then the song's over in like three and a half minutes or something. It's almost like it's like a fucking really sad pop song, but also not a pop song at all. Like it's I don't know, it's just what it's like, yeah, it's one of those things that I it it literally has the pop it has had the pop music effect on me where I've just been wanting to play it again and listen to it again. And I've heard it like fucking a thousand times. I don't know why this past week it's just latched onto my my um soft brain, but it has. Um what's your song recommendation for the week?

Jimmy 1:40:03

Oh, song recommendation for the week. Uh only because we um we spoke about them before, but cosmic psychos, better not bitter. Nice. Yeah for the Rizzler. No, for the Rizzler. Yeah, well, and and I honestly we're at work today and we walked into this area to get stuff done, and there was just shit everywhere. And that song I just went, smoking bullshit, mate! And one of the boys' like, what's that? I'm like, You haven't heard that song? And I whacked it on, and so yeah, we we all had a bit of a laugh to that. And so yeah, you go home and listen to Better Not Bitter by the Cosmic Psychos.

Owen 1:40:40

Yeah, hopefully the Rizzler listens to it on his way in tomorrow.

Jimmy 1:40:44

Let's hope so. Cool, cool, all right. Well, thank you very much. Um, thanks Owen for everything you do. Um, I wouldn't be able to do this without you. Uh, so you know, big props to Owen and um thanks everyone else for joining me on the journey. See you next time.